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Question So... How about that weather?

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6 years 2 months ago - 6 years 2 months ago #1 by Rose Bunny

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I'm bundling up, we have plenty of firewood, The house is energy-efficient and we don't often have to turn the heat up too much here due to it, but tomorrow begins the onslaught.... I apologize for the capitals, the National Weather Service likes to yell at me.

...HISTORIC COLD EXPECTED TUESDAY THROUGH THURSDAY MORNING... .WIND CHILLS ARE EXPECTED TO FALL TO 25 BELOW TO 35 BELOW ZERO TONIGHT AND TUESDAY MORNING. DANGEROUS WIND CHILLS OF 45 BELOW TO 65 BELOW ZERO ARE EXPECTED FOR MOST OF THE PERIOD FROM TUESDAY NIGHT THROUGH THURSDAY MORNING. THIS IS A LIFE-THREATENING SITUATION FOR THOSE SPENDING ANY PROLONGED PERIOD OUTDOORS WITHOUT PROPER CLOTHING. A WIND CHILL WARNING IS IN EFFECT FROM TUESDAY THROUGH THURSDAY MORNING AREA WIDE. RECORD LOW TEMPERATURES ARE POSSIBLE IN THE TWIN CITIES WEDNESDAY MORNING AND THURSDAY MORNING. THE RECORD FOR WEDNESDAY IS 30 BELOW AND THE RECORD FOR THURSDAY IS 27 BELOW. IN ADDITION, GUSTY WINDS TUESDAY WILL LEAD TO AREAS OF BLOWING SNOW ACROSS WESTERN AND SOUTHERN MINNESOTA. A WINTER WEATHER ADVISORY IS IN EFFECT IN THESE AREAS FROM 10 AM TO 6 PM TUESDAY.

** Dreams of May **

Anyone else out there in the path of the evil? I'm not a Shaman, so why is Kigatilik after me?

High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan

Last Edit: 6 years 2 months ago by Rose Bunny.

6 years 2 months ago #2 by bergy

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I know what you mean. Here in Tucson it's supposed to get to down to a frigid 45 degrees Fahrenheit tonight and the forecasters are looking to see that we just edge over 70 in the afternoon.

Seriously, I've got family in eastern Iowa and Wisconsin and I've been watching the piles of snow forming over the last couple of weeks. Funnily enough I kind of miss all the snow. Not so much the back-breaking labor of shoveling the driveway with a rusty, ancient shovel so much as my mom greeting me at the doorway afterwards with a mug of warm milk with a touch of honey.

I'll send some warm thoughts your way, Rose.

6 years 2 months ago #3 by null0trooper

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It looks like Miami will be 100F warmer than parts of Minnesota.

Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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Discussion Thread

6 years 2 months ago #4 by Polk Kitsune

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For me, up in Canada... -18C, converted to F... 0 Degrees Fahrenheit. Typical winter temps.

Still, for those in that vortex, I hope you all bundle up tight. It'll be a doozy.

My story: Evershade: Reforming

6 years 2 months ago #5 by Kristin Darken

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Be safe, everyone.

Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.

6 years 2 months ago #6 by Kettlekorn

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I'm in Knoxville, TN, where I guess people are mildly stressed out and considering school closings since it's going to be a little below freezing and we'll probably get some snow. I grew up in an old farmhouse about an hour west of Duluth, MN, so I'm mostly just rolling my eyes. Plus, a nice little perk of living in a middle apartment is that I only lose heat through my two smallest walls. I haven't needed to use my heater yet this winter, and I don't plan to start now.

I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.

6 years 2 months ago - 6 years 2 months ago #7 by Schol-R-LEA

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Meanwhile, in Athens, GA, I have to keep a window open to prevent my fourth floor (of four) studio apartment from spiking into the 80s at random intervals, with a monster fan pointed at the ceiling on the opposite end of the main room to keep the air circulating, as well. Though if it gets as cold here as they are saying (ooh, just below freezing, how scary for someone who grew up in Connecticut...

) I may be able to keep it closed for a few days.

Don't even ask what the power bill is during the summer months (which go from late April to some time in October, apparently...). I try to avoid going outside as much as possible during those months.

(Actually, I'm pretty much hikki all year 'round anyway, but that's a separate issue. Anxiety is one hell of a drug.)

Out, damnéd Spot! Bad Doggy!

Last Edit: 6 years 2 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.

6 years 2 months ago - 6 years 2 months ago #8 by Rose Bunny

Rose Bunny
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Posts: 1956

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Weather Channel says:
CHASKA, MN (55318)
as of 8:06 pm CST
-22°
MOSTLY CLOUDY
feels like -51°
H -- L -27°
UV Index 0 of 10

High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan

Last Edit: 6 years 2 months ago by Rose Bunny.

6 years 2 months ago - 6 years 2 months ago #9 by JG

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this just reminds me of when I tried living in georgia and they had Ice on the roads. I was entertained watching people unable to escape their parking spaces, because I live in alaska.

I'm pretty sure If I didn't recently have a bout of -40 and more I would be more sympathetic.

But when I forgot to plug my car in (there's three separate heaters in my car) my battery discharged completely in 4 seconds and the car failed to turn over.

So my best constructive recommendation: If it hits negative 22 in an area without the infrastructure to cope with the cold?

Call in, because it's dangerous to be out in that cold without the equipment, experience or knowledge on how to cope with it.

Even the "Heavy winter coats" requiered to deal with those situations are grossly different from the "Heavy winter coats" you will find in places like... florida, or even chicago.

If the ice is more than a quarter-inch thick DO NOT pour water under your tires to get free. Even if you succeed (this is extremely unlikely, because you will be spinning your tires on ice with a thin layer of water on top) you will coat your tires inside the tread with a layer of ice. It'll break loose sooner or later, but I'll be later because standards, rigid road tires do not handle ice well.

If you have to drive:

start your car and let it run for ten minutes every four hours. -22 is enough to freeze your battery, oil pan and engine block. If your electrical system freezes, your battery may discharge completely rather than starting the car.

DO NOT use cruise control on ice. EVER. If you lose traction your wheels will hit max RPM in less than a second and send you into a spin. You WILL go off the road or hit someone.

Do not accelerate on uphill travel on ice. maintain a steady speed. do not ever change speed if you do not have to. You don't have the correct tires, and I speak from experience, sliding BACKWARD down a large hill will be a panic attack moment.

Keep as much distance between yourself and EVERY OTHER DRIVER that you can. Assume everyone knows less about driving on ice than you do. Because odds are, this is the case.

Most importantly, do not drive any faster than you believe you can consistently maintain positive control of the vehicle. If a cop pulls you over and asks why you are going so slow? "I am maintaining a speed I believe it is safe to drive at in these road conditions" They're a lot less likely to cite you. Be polite. You can fight a ticket in court because you can also be ticketed for driving too fast for conditions if you spin out at or below the speed limit.

If you feel like you cannot safely get to work because of conditions, call out. Use your sick pay or something.

Much as I like to mock people who don't live covered in ice 8 months out of the year, taking unnecessary risks in an area that does not have the emergency and survival infrastructure is a sucker bet. Don't take unnecessary risks.

Last Edit: 6 years 2 months ago by JG.

6 years 2 months ago #10 by lighttech

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Funny true story

about 25 years ago I walking into work on a VERY cold week in LA and my foot slipped on a patch of ICE in the parking lot...my LA brain did not connect the 'white' and clear speckled stuff to 'ice' and my career in movies to that point made me think "what or who is the moron that left SFX or make-up slime out in the parking lot?" I did not even think ICE for an hour...lol

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Author of Vantier and Shadowsblade on Bigcloset

6 years 2 months ago #11 by Rose Bunny

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It continues:

CHASKA, MN (55318)
as of 9:18 am CST
-25°
SUNNY
feels like -48°
H -15° / L -31°

High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan

6 years 2 months ago #12 by elrodw

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JG wrote: Call in, because it's dangerous to be out in that cold without the equipment, experience or knowledge on how to cope with it.

Even the "Heavy winter coats" requiered to deal with those situations are grossly different from the "Heavy winter coats" you will find in places like... florida, or even chicago.

If the ice is more than a quarter-inch thick DO NOT pour water under your tires to get free. Even if you succeed (this is extremely unlikely, because you will be spinning your tires on ice with a thin layer of water on top) you will coat your tires inside the tread with a layer of ice. It'll break loose sooner or later, but I'll be later because standards, rigid road tires do not handle ice well.

If you have to drive:

start your car and let it run for ten minutes every four hours. -22 is enough to freeze your battery, oil pan and engine block. If your electrical system freezes, your battery may discharge completely rather than starting the car.

DO NOT use cruise control on ice. EVER. If you lose traction your wheels will hit max RPM in less than a second and send you into a spin. You WILL go off the road or hit someone.

Do not accelerate on uphill travel on ice. maintain a steady speed. do not ever change speed if you do not have to. You don't have the correct tires, and I speak from experience, sliding BACKWARD down a large hill will be a panic attack moment.

Keep as much distance between yourself and EVERY OTHER DRIVER that you can. Assume everyone knows less about driving on ice than you do. Because odds are, this is the case.

Most importantly, do not drive any faster than you believe you can consistently maintain positive control of the vehicle. If a cop pulls you over and asks why you are going so slow? "I am maintaining a speed I believe it is safe to drive at in these road conditions" They're a lot less likely to cite you. Be polite. You can fight a ticket in court because you can also be ticketed for driving too fast for conditions if you spin out at or below the speed limit.

If you feel like you cannot safely get to work because of conditions, call out. Use your sick pay or something.

Much as I like to mock people who don't live covered in ice 8 months out of the year, taking unnecessary risks in an area that does not have the emergency and survival infrastructure is a sucker bet. Don't take unnecessary risks.

As one who grew up and learned to drive in ice and snow in South Dakota, I will second every single thing JG said. If you don't have LOTS of experience driving on ice and snow, you are a hazard to yourself, your passengers, and everyone around you. No joke. Standard all-season tires are not proper winter tires and are not suited for heavy ice and snow, period. Going backwards down a hill is not fun, like JG said. I would characterize it as a "brown trousers" moment, though. It will scare the hell out of you. If you end up off the road and unable to get help quickly, you could freeze to death. If you don't have proper gear for survival in your car, don't risk getting stuck where you might not be able to get help.

Temperatures - they will kill you. At -20 and lower, exposed skin will freeze in far less time than you think. At best you will have frostbite. You would need lots of thousands of calories a day to keep your body warm enough. Yes, multiple THOUSANDS. Most people can't do it. Do NOT use alcohol as an antifreeze for your body. All it will do is dialate your capillaries and make your blood flow closer to your skin surface, which takes away blood flow to your core organs, which will then start to suffer hypothermia. Alcohol and cold-weather endurance is a VERY bad idea.

Stay safe. I like our readers (well, most of you

) and I'd much rather not hear about someone who took a chance and lost the roll of the dice.

Never give up, Never surrender! Captain Peter Quincy Taggert

6 years 2 months ago #13 by Rose Bunny

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Posts: 1956

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I haven't been outside since Monday, and won't go outside until this is over ( should be done Friday).

CHASKA, MN (55318)
as of 11:14 pm CST
-24°
CLEAR
feels like -35°
H -- L -31°

High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan

6 years 2 months ago - 6 years 2 months ago #14 by Kristin Darken

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I grew up right on the edge of the Late Erie snow effect ring ... where, while we only rarely got temperature below -20, we DID get a lot of snow and ice. So it isn't surprising that I've driven in weather conditions that most southerners will never face... and snow and ice are actually NOT the top of the list for dangerous roads. That title belongs to flooding and mud slides. While snow may drift and block passage without the proper off road gear; flooding is the scariest driving. It takes only a moment for something to block enough water upstream of you to create a surge that will lift your car and turn you into floating debris. Also, you have no idea whether there is still road under what looks like a couple inches of water. Quick moving drainage... streams ... can undercut or completely remove bridges, roads, etc. Leaving you driving off a cliff into deep water. At which point, you are once again, floating debris. Floating debris is bad, by the way... because floating debris is what kills most people in a flood (the other being hypothermia, spring rains resulting in flooding tend to be very cold water)... swimming, finding solid structures and so on isn't too hard unless you're caught in a fast moving current... but it takes no time at all to get clipped by something and become disoriented or to get pinned under or between debris and have your freedom of movement taken away.

You could always tell the northern guys in the military during snows.We were the ones forming rescue parties to go out in groups and pull people out of ditches while towns our bases/shipyards were in closed down because no one knew how to handle the weather. I'm reminded of Bremerton Washington when it snows. They get so little of it and it is usually washed away by rain within days... they don't have the support mechanisms to handle it. So it falls almost completely (or did when I was there) for Navy guys from northern states to step up any time more than a dusting of snow hit the ground.

Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.

Last Edit: 6 years 2 months ago by Kristin Darken.

6 years 2 months ago #15 by Katssun

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Regarding rolling down hills backwards, I find going up them extremely slowly (~1 mph) with the wheels spinning all the time, much, much scarier. You have no idea what's going to happen. You might make it up, you might roll backward, you might go sideways into something, into another car, into a person! You might go off sideways!

Once you start rolling backward. It's over. You can do your best to straighten the car out, and gently go backward. The moment of uncertainty is gone. It's happened.

6 years 2 months ago #16 by CrazyMinh

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Massive winds, torrential rain and a baking summer afternoon here in Sydney. The day started out humid, but less hot; and ended up being 40 degrees or something.

For those Americans confused by this, I mean degrees celsius. Obviously. If you want the imperial <shudder> measurement:

40 degrees celsius = 104 degrees Fahrenheit

Humidity was 73%. Winds were around 53 kmh^-1, and it's gusting outside now with sheets of rain.

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You can also check out my fanfiction guest riffs at Library of the Dammed

6 years 2 months ago #17 by CrazyMinh

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CrazyMinh wrote: Massive winds, torrential rain and a baking summer afternoon here in Sydney. The day started out humid, but less hot; and ended up being 40 degrees or something.

For those Americans confused by this, I mean degrees celsius. Obviously. If you want the imperial <shudder> measurement:

40 degrees celsius = 104 degrees Fahrenheit

Humidity was 73%. Winds were around 53 kmh^-1, and it's gusting outside now with sheets of rain.

Tomorrow is meant to be a slightly cooler, but still baking 30-39 degrees celsius (86-102 degrees Fahrenheit). Not sure what else the weather has in stall for us. I mean, seriously. We've been in a state of drought for about six months now, milk prices are up alongside all other dairy products (and quite a few of our beef products as well) since the cattle are without water, thus the farmers are strapped for cash, and thus one of our largest industries has ground to a halt. The tropics are shifting south this summer, and Sydney has become soupy as all hell. Walking outside feels like wading through a bowl of soup. It really pisses me off, considering that we were sub-tropical/temperate only around ten or so years ago. Hell, maybe only two or three years back.

But, that line of discussion is going to go nowhere. Cold weather sounds so nice round about now.

You can find my stories at Fanfiction.net here .

You can also check out my fanfiction guest riffs at Library of the Dammed

6 years 2 months ago #18 by Katssun

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So what's the difference (in Fahrenheit) between Rose's wind chill and Minh's heat index?

104F with 73% humidity is a heat index of 160F.

Feels like 200 degrees difference.

It took me a while to find a chart that would list a value for the heat index, other than "Extreme Danger."

6 years 2 months ago #19 by XaltatunOfAcheron

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Katssun wrote: So what's the difference (in Fahrenheit) between Rose's wind chill and Minh's heat index?

104F with 73% humidity is a heat index of 160F.

Feels like 200 degrees difference.

It took me a while to find a chart that would list a value for the heat index, other than "Extreme Danger."

Yesterday I saw an article on why the wind chill factor was complete BS. The author didn't think much of the replacements, either. Unfortunately, it seems to have scrolled off the news cycle.

6 years 2 months ago #20 by Rose Bunny

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Posts: 1956

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it's getting better. tomorrow's high is expected to be positive 20.

currently:

CHASKA, MN (55318)
as of 9:28 am CST
-19°
FAIR
feels like -19°
H -1° / L -5°

High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan

6 years 2 months ago #21 by elrodw

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XaltatunOfAcheron wrote: Yesterday I saw an article on why the wind chill factor was complete BS. The author didn't think much of the replacements, either. Unfortunately, it seems to have scrolled off the news cycle.

If you look at it from a thermodynamics sense, wind chill makes perfect sense. Absent any wind, the body loses energy due to conduction to the cold air and some to black-body radiation. There is a thermal gradient that forms where the air closer to the body is warmer, and air temperature decreases as one moves away (distances are very small). There is minor convective current in this boundary layer, so the primary means of moving heat from the body and from air molecule to air molecule is conduction. As the boundary layer forms and equilibrates, at any point in that boundary layer, as you move some small distance either nearer or further the temperature difference is much significantly less (it's a gradient, after all, not a sharp boundary), so the conduction is reduced (rate of conduction depends on temperature difference). We have an state of equilibrium.

Once you add wind, you disturb the boundary layer, either greatly thinning it or stripping it away. The thermal gradient is much steeper, so conduction is increased, and thus the effective rate of heat dissipation is increased. The wind chill factor is a crude attempt to say that at a given temperature with a given wind speed, the rate of heat loss is equivalent to a lower still air temperature.

It's crude, but the principle is thermodynamically sound.

Never give up, Never surrender! Captain Peter Quincy Taggert

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Question So... How about that weather?

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