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Question More Questions about changes from mutation...

9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #1 by Malady
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    • A while ago, I asked about amputation on Low-level Exemplars and got this:

    Kristin Darken wrote on Sun, 03 May 2015 01:57 wrote: Exemplar regen functions at the equivalent of Regen 2 levels below the Exemplar ranking. So an Exemplar 3 recovers at the rate a Regen 1 would... Exemplar 5 as if they were also Regen 3. Below Exemplar 3, they will typically see 'better' healing (injuries will be less likely to scar or leave flaws but will typically not heal any faster than baselines). That means that a stump is less likely to just take the skin graft and heal over... it will persist in trying to grow 'out' but it will do so at rates that could take years... which could be more problematic than not, because you ideally would 'prefer' the wound to close over... but it won't, so it might end up being an open weeping wound for some time while it tries to return to being a hand).


    But, I was trying to generalize from a specific case of biological brain and body alteration.

    [Using] a series of tests, studies, lectures, medicines, body stimulations (drugs injected directly into a blood vessel, brain being pierced directly from behind the ears) and hypnosis, a person's [body] can be modified.


    But, I found a better generalization to ask about:

    If a mutant had synesthesia or perfect pitch before mutation into a pure EX-<3, what happens to those abilities? Might they be removed if they aren't part of the BIT?

    What if they were Gadgeteers, Devisors, or ESPers? I guess their neurological changes would usually mean that synesthesia or perfect pitch would disappear...

    And I never asked:

    "If an amputee that mutates into a pure EX-<3, what happens to the amputation stump if the BIT specifies a full arm?"

    Or, would the peoples' self-identities possibly manage to preserve their conditions?

    [And this is my last question on this topic for now, as in creating this question I came upon the answers I was looking for, so now this is here just for curiosity.]
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    Last Edit: 9 years 4 months ago by Malady.
    9 years 4 months ago #2 by Kristin Darken
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    • Synethesia is a barely understood concept in our medical science and you want us to give detailed explanations of how having a BIT would interact with that? You can make up something reasonably believable just as easily as we can... the only reason we would go to that level of detail is if we were writing a plotline or character based on that.
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    9 years 4 months ago #3 by Malady
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: Synethesia is a barely understood concept in our medical science and you want us to give detailed explanations of how having a BIT would interact with that? You can make up something reasonably believable just as easily as we can... the only reason we would go to that level of detail is if we were writing a plotline or character based on that.


    Umm... I don't need anything detailed, just if it would be kept or not, if the Exemplar Trait at 1 or 2 would force shifts in... neurology into a more 'baseline EX' form... Hmm... Well, higher levels more BIT conformation, I guess, like Pygmy BIT at EX 1/2 just has "Stop Growing" and not "Start Shrinking" so loss would occur at higher levels unless the skill was part of the BIT's brain component. Okay.

    Extrapolation of EX neurology from known info [ Click to expand ]
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    9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #4 by jmhyp
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    • Odds are, if a BIT can change a person's physical sex traits, it can regrow an arm.
    Last Edit: 9 years 4 months ago by jmhyp. Reason: lost apostrophe
    9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #5 by Malady
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    • jmhyp wrote: Odds are, if a BIT can change a person's physical sex traits, it can regrow an arm.


    Yeah. True. But have we seen any EX-1/2 sex changers or any other possessors of "unexpected physical developments"?

    The wiki says:

    Level 1 Exemplars wrote: This may shape people into alternate genders or give unexpected physical developments, without necessarily granting superhuman powers. Tend to heal quickly and are resistant to disease


    But, those descriptions are currently being reworked...
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    Last Edit: 9 years 4 months ago by Malady.
    9 years 4 months ago #6 by Kristin Darken
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    • Let me point out that Regen does not imply cloning with every cut off piece of tissue. In fact, that's a very uncommon result in the Whateley Universe because it implies a couple things to exist to degrees that are biologically implausible. For example:

    You cut off an arm. Does the arm grow back on the mutant? Yes, it does... at a relatively accelerated pace given sufficiently high Regen rates. In SOME types of Regen. After all, some Regen is about healing the injury. Other types of Regen focus on restoration to a default state (which may be defined by genetics or a BIT or just some psychological base point). Does the arm grow another body? Unlikely. Why? In order for the arm to grow additional tissue, it needs a source of energy for cell reproduction. Without the support of lungs and heart to move the blood around to supply energy to the tissue in the arm, it will quickly deplete what is immediately available to it and begin a starvation process.

    So, you see, Regeneration is capped by nutrient supply... if the existing resources are high enough to reproduce critical functions before starvation occurs, then it can happen. Otherwise, it starves.

    Where you DO see a limb regenerate into a full body, the ability almost never takes into account starvation or mass consistency. A 5 pound limb cannot hold the resources to produce a 130 pound body. In order for this to occur, the limb would need access to outside power that it can turn into biological growth and convert to organic resources for mass production. Could that particular power set exist? Yep. But its not present in 'every' regenerating mutant.

    Does the healing process from Regen or the Exemplar equivalent correct things like Synethesia or other biological conditions. It CAN. Assuming the body / Regen recognizes those as things that are 'broken.' You could just as easily have horrible allergies before manifesting with Regen 3 and be allergy free the rest of your life... as you could have those allergies while a mutant too. Except now, your Regen makes your meds completely useless... so you just have to suffer the obnoxiousness of the allergy symptoms.
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    9 years 4 months ago #7 by E M Pisek
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    • Wouldn't this also imply that somewhere within the matrix of the body a signal is sent to, just for hypothetical purposes and not to be construed as true, is located in the brain, so that when a limb is lost the matrix is conducted on the body so that when compared against it, such as an arm, the body knows what needs to be repaired/replaced and thus cauterizes the wound first as well as begins the appropriate reconstruction of said limb? Thus the individual does not bleed to death while the body skin graphs the bones, blood vessels and so forth?

    Of course if the matrix was contained in the head then if the individual is decapitated it would be logical to assume the body would die as well as there was no way to breath without choking off the oxygen supply as it tries to regen a human skull and so forth.

    There also of course may be more than one location or the body is hardwired to where its constantly sending out a signal to all parts of itself to verify that nothing is amiss.
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    9 years 4 months ago #8 by Valentine
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    • Have we seen any mutant, other than Tennyo, actually regrow major body parts? Jade regrew part of her hand and that took hours, but mostly he regen is shown closing wounds and reattaching parts. Even the kid that Kodiak nearly killed, was mostly there if not intact when he regened.

    Razorback has high regen, and JimmyT(?) and both of those are shown having to eat massive amounts after big fights.

    Does Jimmy have Regen or does he fake it, with it shapeshifting?
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    9 years 4 months ago #9 by Kettlekorn
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    • Another fun possibility for non-exemplars is that the regen might not be perfectly consistent. Each time you regenerate an eyeball, there could be a chance you end up with astigmatism, color blindness, or other issues. Regenerating your inner ear could result in it having a slightly different frequency response. Regenerating a whole hand could end up having the nerves spread a bit differently, so that it's initially clumsy and things feel like they're happening at slightly different places than they actually are until your brain adapts.
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    9 years 4 months ago #10 by E M Pisek
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    • Kettlekorn wrote: Another fun possibility for non-exemplars is that the regen might not be perfectly consistent. Each time you regenerate an eyeball, there could be a chance you end up with astigmatism, color blindness, or other issues. Regenerating your inner ear could result in it having a slightly different frequency response. Regenerating a whole hand could end up having the nerves spread a bit differently, so that it's initially clumsy and things feel like they're happening at slightly different places than they actually are until your brain adapts.


    Or the hand may not look like your original. It may be clawed, self aware as it goes out on its own looking to have a little fun. It may look, feminine on a brick. Oh the horror if it broke a nail.
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    9 years 4 months ago #11 by Dawnfyre
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    • Merry/Paige/Petra, the only story arc where an amputated limb grows a complete new body.

    Merry, a fairly substantial healing trait, energizer, cyberpath. Infected with the were virus and her arm was amputated due to resistance to the were virus. That resistance was from a magical talisman that gives her access to healing powers.

    The new body had no memories, no soul. Sara split Merry's soul between the two bodies, at the same time she shifted half of Merry;s personalities into the new body. This gave us Paige with Merry and AI personalities and Petra with Chad and Chaddy personalities. Both have cyberpath and energizer abilities, as well as the healing and both wind up with the magic talisman.

    They both needed a lot of food after the process was completed, Petra far more than Paige.
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    9 years 4 months ago - 9 years 4 months ago #12 by Kettlekorn
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    • That was the magic ring's doing though (or more accurately, the power it connects to), not a mutant power. If it hadn't been wearing that ring, the arm wouldn't have been able to grow a Petra. Compare to how slowly Paige is regrowing her arm.
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    Last Edit: 9 years 4 months ago by Kettlekorn.
    9 years 4 months ago #13 by Dawnfyre
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    • I know, that is the point that corroborates Krysten's post about limbs not growing a new body.
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