Question Power Quarks/Limits

I'm trying to work out the parameters for my mimic's powers. I know she has a partial 'mimic's the donor's appearance' thing going on, and that mimicked powers fade after an hour or so. What I'm stuck on is storing powers, like Counterpoint's libraries of powers. I was thinking , as she is almost like a quasi-avatar, sucking in trapped 'soul' fragments from peeped mirrors, there should be a limit on how long the stored energy would last. And she only gets one use.

There is, but I haven't quite fully defined it yet past "dosen't grow limbs and limbs don't change" So she'll just get scales if Diamondback shows up, ot have her legs go tail. unless she also mimics a true shapshifter.

I personally like the idea of separating the 'energy' used to power a mimicked ability from the 'information' on how to mimic it. Unless your mimic actually de-powers their donor I've always felt that it seems more reasonable that what they take is the information needed to replicate a power and then their own body provides the energy required to use it.

It also allows for separate mechanisms, and therefore limits, for storing versus using abilities. How many abilities you can store and for how long are a question of 'memory' while how powerful and sustained an active ability is is question of energy reserves.

This would probably mean that a power would last the same amount of use time regardless of whether it was freshly copied or about to be lost and that obtaining a new power wouldn't instantly refresh the energy required to use it, which may or may not be what you want.

Hm. I like where Hebblejebble's idea is going. If the mimic has their own energy (re)source(s) and works by first analyzing/building the power description based on exposure to the power, then translating that code into an algorithm for turning the energy they have into the desired effects, you can specify all sorts of limits and exceptions in your story.

The description could be incomplete to start with, or become corrupted by merging the memory of two similar-looking powers that work differently. It could degrade over time if not used, without that being obvious until too late. Some translations could just work better or worse than others because of experience with them, or bad experiences because of them.

Kristin Darken wrote:

Hebblejebble wrote: It also allows for separate mechanisms, and therefore limits, for storing versus using abilities. How many abilities you can store and for how long are a question of 'memory' while how powerful and sustained an active ability is is question of energy reserves.

Note that 'most' of the mimics you've seen in Universe use the power they steal/acquire differently from the way the source does.

The problem with power mimics is that some powers should be physically reliable on biological 'enhancements' so the speak. Exemplars probably have denser muscle tissue and brains with much higher surface area (the surface area of the brain's grey matter is the dependant factor in animal intelligence. Whales have much larger brains than humans, but have less folds in their external brain tissue. Dogs and cats have the capability of achieving the approximate intellectual function of a human two year old, though they exceed a two year old in other ways (such as strategic thinking, spacial thinking and pattern recognition (which is highly important to social interaction, something that allows animals to be domesticated)). Dolphins, who have a slightly smaller average brain mass and size than humans are theorised to be on par with humans with logical, emotional, and social intellect, but could easily surpass us (alla HHG2TG 'So Long and Thanks for all the fish'). Exemplars are essentially Human + 1. They would source their powers biologically rather than from unknown sources. In fact, every mutant would have a biological adaptation to allow them use of their powers. Maybe all magical power is in the WU is the ability to intuitively 'understand' how magic works on a different level that a baseline?

The idea of a mimic who also mimics some physical characteristics of a being is a really good idea. In fact, it's probably the most scientifically accurate depiction of how a shifting power would work, at least in relation to Exemplar-level abilities, and some ESP abilities.

Although, this is all conjecture based on extrapolation of the knowledge presented in the stories, and glued together with knowledge gained through my science obsession. Seriously, the Internet is here for more than just email, FaceBook, and cat photos/videos...

What about a Mimic that is only able to copy the powers from Exemplars?

They could use a Shifter power, but would have a mutable BIT.

Normally Bit's are immutable, as they are fixed during the first manifestation, but if the Shifter trait is linked to the Exemplar trait, then it could work differently.

This would also give a nice power balance to the character, as they could potentially have all of the strengths of an Exemplar, but also more of the weaknesses, both mental and physical.

There's any number of ways that this pattern of traits could be used creatively in story=telling.

CrazyMinh wrote: Maybe all magical power is in the WU is the ability to intuitively 'understand' how magic works on a different level that a baseline?

Probably not, since baselines inherently have the capacity to use magic and psi. Mutants with the WIZ trait tend to score higher on intelligence metrics because discipline and Will are required secondary powers.

Kristin Darken wrote: or Warping (which creates an alternately defined means of producing a similar effect by imposing an external dimensional set of universal laws within the context of the power's operation (makes those biological enhancements unnecessary because it changes the way the universe works)....

Does that mean that Devisors and Warpers are very simular in the way their powers function?

If you think about it, Devisors change the way the universe works on a small scale (making some combination of parts that wouldn't usually function in the specified way work or some computer code that should throw up huge flaws when compiled actually do something other than make you debug for hours), while warpers change the way the universe works on a scale that- while usually still limited to their immediate selves or local proximity- still changes things about the laws of physics. I didn't notice this before, but you also can group pretty much every power in the WU into a smaller set of categories:

1. Reality-distortion powers:
- Warpers
- Devisors
- Energisers (i.e. breaking a little bit of the Laws of Conservation of matter and energy; breaking the Laws of Thermodynamics)
- (some) power mimics
- (some) manifestors

2. Martial powers:
- PK field manipulation
- Exemplar trait
- Shifters
- (some) power mimics
-Regenerators

3. Psychic/Mental-based powers:
- (Some) manifestors
- Avatars
- ESPers (inc. Gadgeteers)
- Mages

Classifying all of these powers under three categories is actually a lot easier than having, what, 15+ different things to get a handle on. In essence, a lot of these 'base' powers (talking your standard mutant, not your unusual Kimba-style 'special petal' i.e. mutants who can just fly, and not also throw antimatter or survive nukes) are just variations on a theme. A gadgeteer IS different than a devisor, but they both built sh*t. However, a warper is not all that different functionally than a devisor, although their powers affect a different domain (i.e. the laws of physics directly, rather than through the medium of a invention). A shifter is not that different than a power mimic: it's just the domain their powers effect. A lot of powers in the WU are intricate in the way they interconnect under the surface. Energisers and manifestors? You can draw links. ESPers and Avatars? The similarities are present. Mages are a bit of a wildcard, as they don't really fit the pattern. But, you could say that they are linked to Avatars, in that many Avatars also obtain magic as part of the bond with their spirit. Then there's the regenerators, who often also share their regen with the exemplar trait.

What do you think?

CrazyMinh wrote:

Kristin Darken wrote: or Warping (which creates an alternately defined means of producing a similar effect by imposing an external dimensional set of universal laws within the context of the power's operation (makes those biological enhancements unnecessary because it changes the way the universe works)....

Does that mean that Devisors and Warpers are very simular in the way their powers function?

Possibly yes: Kristen Darken on the Gadgeteer and Devisor traits:

whateleyacademy.net/index.php/forum/revi...icer-relevants#49186

Devisors? [...] crossover between Clairvoyance/Paragon and Warping.... and its the Warping that syncs the object to the alternate dimension and allows it to work here and why if it isn't used by the Devisor that it can fail (desync and tries to work in WU laws).

CrazyMinh wrote: - Energisers (i.e. breaking a little bit of the Laws of Conservation of matter and energy; breaking the Laws of Thermodynamics)

The energy that the energizer manipulates doesn't necessarily come from their metabolism but by tapping the earth's electromagnetic field. Measure the total energy in that field before and after a power's usage, accounting for all other inputs and outputs, and then we can talk about conservation of energy. Otherwise you aren't looking at a closed system, and those "Laws" no longer apply.

As far as the principles of thermodynamics go: "Thermodynamics proposes; kinetics disposes."

CrazyMinh wrote: 2. Martial powers:

Now you're just screwing with people.

"useful in a fight" doesn't make those powers similar in function to each other.

null0trooper wrote:

CrazyMinh wrote: 2. Martial powers:

Now you're just screwing with people.

"useful in a fight" doesn't make those powers similar in function to each other.

Oh, sorry. That WAS a bit confusing...damm, I just realised how bloody passive agressive that sounded, and I apologise. That tone was completely accidental.

<ahem>

By 'Martial' I didn't mean 'Martial Arts'. It was, in retrospect, the wrong word. What I SHOULD have said was any power that directly corelates to physical enhancement or improvement. You COULD argue that that means that PK powers don't fall under that, but...yeah, I probably grouped that wrong.

As for thermodynamics, I actually didn't think about it not being a closed system. However, it IS a closed system overall and now I'm bloody overthinking it. S**t. I was about to comment on the earth being a closed system, before I realised that a) the sun provides all of our thermal input, and b) a lot of that is reflected or otherwise bled into space.

Damm. I honestly should have remembered the bit about where energisers source their power from.

right, I'm over thinking it. -takes slow breath- as long as I'm consistent I'm good