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Question What do we know about what's happening in GEO?

9 years 3 months ago #1 by Malady
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    • What do we know about what's happening in GEO?

    Most everyone is on Tertius, but apparently we've got a few people on Secundus?

    We've got no idea what's happening in Primus...

    Given that Fey and Sara have dropped off GEO, presumably... And depending on how good GEO is in handling Seramis and Marala, Tertius Server should experience some big changes? Seramis should be killed off by the AI soon, given that the AI doesn't seem to want Seramis, according to the Whisper Arc?
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    9 years 3 months ago #2 by Kristin Darken
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    • And thus a big factor in why the Fling storyline is trailing the main storyline so much. Neither Marala or Seramis' presence in the GEO plotline are what we might call critical elements. There will (and would have been) a need for resolution of some kind in those side plots in the near future of the WA timeline anyway. Sara and Aung's involvement in the progression of those servers will now resolve itself. But to some extent, will also evolve to be elements in the progression of the Whisper side plots of GEO. But timeline wise, most of what you know about the more recent activities of Marala and Seramis comes via Whisper and predate a lot of the Spring semester chaos.

    As to the different servers... the specific balance of Light and Dark is different on each of the three servers. That has resulted in a different 'skill level' and archetype balance on each... but not in any way that is important enough that the details matter. The mechanics keep things from getting too radically different, though. It isn't the ingame story and how the different servers play out the exploration and integration of their worlds that is important in the long run...
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    9 years 3 months ago #3 by jmhyp
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    • I always assumed Fey would feel obligated to continue playing since the President is aware of her involvement with Whisper. Even after the death of Aung, Fey still has a strong sense of duty, and it would be interesting to see how the game modifies her character since it will detect her personality change.

    Whisper also seems a bit afraid of GEO. (Although she just need to disable the vehicle interface module before playing so it doesn't plug her in so fully. She'll figure that out eventually.) Whisper's timeline is falling behind as the semester finals are finally starting up. But she certainly isn't going back online (probably) before Aung's death.

    GEO itself will have to deal with Sara's disappearance. That in itself could be funny as the light triumphs a bit more brightly while she's gone.
    9 years 2 months ago #4 by Kettlekorn
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    • jmhyp wrote: GEO itself will have to deal with Sara's disappearance. That in itself could be funny as the light triumphs a bit more brightly while she's gone.


    Maybe. Or maybe her absence creates a power vacuum that gets filled by somebody more malevolent. I wonder if Eldritch can get the sparklies under control enough for gaming...
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    9 years 2 months ago #5 by Domoviye
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    • Because she could tattoo herself (somehow) she has that under control and has since Christmas break, at least from seeing her acting in Ayla's stories around the Team Tactics class.
    9 years 2 months ago #6 by jmhyp
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    • I don't really see Eldritch going for a video game. And her POV stories stopped being written only slightly after Sara's.

    We will likely be waiting on Whisper to keep us up to date in Gen1. I doubt Gen2 will have GEO4 in it. :)
    9 years 2 months ago #7 by DanZilla
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    • jmhyp wrote: I don't really see Eldritch going for a video game. And her POV stories stopped being written only slightly after Sara's.


    There was a bit about Eldritch not being able to use her computer when she first changed so she couldn't play GEO anymore...
    9 years 2 months ago #8 by Kristin Darken
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    • jmhyp wrote: We will likely be waiting on Whisper to keep us up to date in Gen1. I doubt Gen2 will have GEO4 in it. :)


    Nope, Gen2 has couple types of gaming that have dominance in the market. One is based on the prevalence of tablets and hologram/hard light interfaces, HUDs and movement/touch oriented interfaces. The other type has filled the niche left by MMO's and some other things. You'll see example of a number of these sorts of things in the upcoming stories.
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    8 years 8 months ago #9 by marie7342231
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    • I was just wondering, what is GEO like in Gen2? If it was so advanced in 2007, imagine what the wizards/devisors would have created 9 years later.

    Thanks KD!
    8 years 8 months ago #10 by Kristin Darken
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    • There is more to the GEO storyline and that will play out as we move through the Gen 1 - Year 2 timeframe. I will say that everything to know about GEO will be known by the end of this second school year...

    By the time Gen 2 rolls around, the gaming industry has recovered and has moved on to a different variety of games (much as has most of our own world's game industry). There is a much larger focus on mobile device games, for instance (not that those are terribly limiting, given the processing power available in the G2 for mobile devices). Also, with the advent of hard light technology, the FPS genre mostly dominates. You can see some evidence of that in the beginning of Road to Whateley, where Nick's team is doing a Rome invasion scenario. Nick/Charger is one of many young men and women who are professional gamers, with sponsorships and a competitive circuit with arenas not unlike our own sports industry.

    As to GEO specifically... while you will find some MMO's... even some in a fantasy setting... the public STILL hasn't recovered from the GEO incident, and old players will tell you...













    What? You didn't think I was actually going to talk about it, did you? :P
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    8 years 8 months ago #11 by Valentine
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    • Besides everyone is off playing Pokemon Go.
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    8 years 8 months ago #12 by NeoMagus
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    • Valentine wrote: Besides everyone is off playing Pokemon Go.


    Well wouldn't you be if you lived in a world that has hard-light and hologram tech? When such a thing as Tavi exists, how epic do you think Pokemon Go could be?
    ... . . -.- / .--- ..- ... - .. -.-. . .-.-.- / .-.. --- ...- . / -- . .-. -.-. -.-- .-.-.- / .-- .- .-.. -.- / .... ..- -- -... .-.. -.-- / .-- .. - .... / -.-- --- ..- .-. / --. --- -.. .-.-.-
    8 years 8 months ago #13 by Sir Lee
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    • I'm still waiting for the impact of the Orange Box among the devisors... October 9, 2007.
    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    8 years 8 months ago #14 by cprime
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    • *looks at Kristin's post* *looks at the Homecoming 2026 section outline* *looks back* *moves the story one more step away from cannon alignment*

    Something to look forward to in the coming school year at least.
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    8 years 8 months ago #15 by Malady
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    • Hmm... I guess this is the general GEO Thread?

    My guess is that it's draining small bits of essence off each player?

    Perhaps funneling it into a deification scheme...

    Or summoning something...

    Large scale possession once enough people's personalities have been analyzed?
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    8 years 3 months ago #16 by Malady
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    • Wait... What if what happened with Whisper is sorta planned, like a Trapped Inside a Video Game scenario, once VR tech has developed to a good point, and then minds are sucked in?

    ... No, still too much like SAO, .Hack//Sign and all the other Trapped In A VideoGame scenarios...

    Let's reverse that. How about a way for the in-game characters to escape or something... The Characters are powered by Essence, forced into the players' bodies, and empowered. Instant Super Army. ... This seems so out of left field, that it seems like it might be right! ... But, perhaps not. What purpose would having an Instant Super Army serve? Perhaps a Universal Invasion from GEO world?
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    8 years 2 months ago #17 by Malady
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    • Well, treating this as a general GEO thread?

    ... We first hear about GEO from Dr. Bellows.

    How did it get its first customers? Did it just appear on shelves with no advertising or something?

    We know it can't be hacked... Although, that's not noted on the Wiki page?

    For financial anonymity, I guess all its profits could go into some private account in the Caymans or something so there's secrecy there too?

    I guess trying to figure GEO from its finances is gonna be discussed in Whisper?
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    8 years 2 months ago #18 by Sir Lee
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    • Malady wrote: We know it can't be hacked... Although, that's not noted on the Wiki page?

    Well, if you have a source for that claim...
    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    8 years 2 months ago - 8 years 2 months ago #19 by Kristin Darken
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    • What makes you think there is financial anonymity?

    The company that published the game isn't EA... but it isn't a complete unknown, either. The design studio that created the game was an unknown prior to its release and they got the game published on its own merits instead of hype. But anonymous? Not.The only complete unknowns are some of the more reclusive lead designers who the company says are unwilling to meet with the press.
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    Last Edit: 8 years 2 months ago by Kristin Darken.
    8 years 2 months ago #20 by Valentine
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    • Sir Lee wrote:

    Malady wrote: We know it can't be hacked... Although, that's not noted on the Wiki page?

    Well, if you have a source for that claim...

    Whisper: Chapter 10 wrote: “Did you download some GEO Add-on or something?” Brenda asks, skeptically.

    “Nope! No Add-ons for me and you know that no one has been able to get those kind of cheats to work. GEO is just too good at detecting hacks.”


    Not quite the same as actually hacking.
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    8 years 1 month ago #21 by wyrm
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    • GEO collapsed after its users defected to the latest Askey Total Immersion multiplayer Third-person video game marketed by AJG Consolidated.
    8 years 1 month ago #22 by Kristin Darken
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    • Uh... wha?
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    8 years 1 month ago #23 by wyrm
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    • Kristin - See Ayla's conversation with Askey in 'Ayla and the Birthday Brawl, Chapter 4'
    8 years 1 month ago #24 by JG
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    • wyrm wrote: GEO collapsed after its users defected to the latest Askey Total Immersion multiplayer Third-person video game marketed by AJG Consolidated.



    YOU!

    THAT'S MY BRIDGE!

    OUT!
    8 years 1 month ago #25 by Kristin Darken
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    • wyrm wrote: Kristin - See Ayla's conversation with Askey in 'Ayla and the Birthday Brawl, Chapter 4'


    Askey is a devisor who has created a VR helm. He's a gamer. That doesn't make him a game developer. It doesn't even necessarily make him a coder/programmer (he's getting HELP from someone else on the programming that his tech needs). And even from that brief interaction, it should be clear that he has no interest in converting it to a gadget for commercial applications.

    So... my "uh... wha?" stands.
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    8 years 1 month ago #26 by Valentine
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: Uh... wha?


    I thought it was just a snarky sort of reply.

    The true reason that GEO died is that Pokemon Go was done the right way, where you could both collect Pokemon and do battle with them via your device.
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    8 years 1 month ago #27 by wyrm
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    • Kristin

    In chapter 4, Diane writes:

    [Ayla] “Askey, you’re still wearing your VR system,” I pointed out.
    [Askey] “Oh. Right.” He pressed a button on the side of the ‘helmet’, and the visor shimmered into transparency. “Oh! Phase. Hi. You here about the game again?”
    [Ayla] I smiled, “No, not this time. I wanted to know if you wanted to come with us to Boston for a luncheon-slash-birthday party on Saturday.”

    Askey doesn't talk about a headset about a headset, or a helmet, or VR, he calls it a game. Then Diane writes:

    [Ayla} “Oh. Okay. And look, if you don’t want to mess with trying to turn that into a pure gadget, I understand. I just thought it would make a game so cool it would make GEO look lame.”

    In turn Ayla calls it a game.

    It may well be that the Cabal's secret bible goes into more detail than Diane does in the story, and Askey has never written a line of code (despite describing himself as a comp-sci type)

    [Askey] “Umm, yeah. You know *!x, right?” I nodded, even though I only knew who he was. And that he pronounced his codename ‘Star-ix’. Askey went on, “Well, some of us comp-sci types call him ‘Splat-bang’ just to tease him. So he’s ‘The Splat’.”

    However, the textual evidence suggest that they are not talking about "A VR Helm", and that Askey does code (Or what on earth is he doing in comp-sci?).

    Agreed, at the time the story is set, Askey shows no interest in commercialising the game, but (as we all know) Ayla can be very persuasive. When Askey sees the revenues that Jericho, Loophole, Bugs and Triaxial are making, his attitude might change.
    8 years 1 month ago #28 by Valentine
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    • wyrm wrote: Kristin

    In chapter 4, Diane writes:

    [Ayla] “Askey, you’re still wearing your VR system,” I pointed out.
    [Askey] “Oh. Right.” He pressed a button on the side of the ‘helmet’, and the visor shimmered into transparency. “Oh! Phase. Hi. You here about the game again?”
    [Ayla] I smiled, “No, not this time. I wanted to know if you wanted to come with us to Boston for a luncheon-slash-birthday party on Saturday.”

    Askey doesn't talk about a headset about a headset, or a helmet, or VR, he calls it a game. Then Diane writes:

    [Ayla} “Oh. Okay. And look, if you don’t want to mess with trying to turn that into a pure gadget, I understand. I just thought it would make a game so cool it would make GEO look lame.”

    In turn Ayla calls it a game.

    It may well be that the Cabal's secret bible goes into more detail than Diane does in the story, and Askey has never written a line of code (despite describing himself as a comp-sci type)

    [Askey] “Umm, yeah. You know *!x, right?” I nodded, even though I only knew who he was. And that he pronounced his codename ‘Star-ix’. Askey went on, “Well, some of us comp-sci types call him ‘Splat-bang’ just to tease him. So he’s ‘The Splat’.”

    However, the textual evidence suggest that they are not talking about "A VR Helm", and that Askey does code (Or what on earth is he doing in comp-sci?).

    Agreed, at the time the story is set, Askey shows no interest in commercialising the game, but (as we all know) Ayla can be very persuasive. When Askey sees the revenues that Jericho, Loophole, Bugs and Triaxial are making, his attitude might change.


    I'd always assumed that Askey had created a VR system that would take a regular game and turn it into a VR 3D game of awesomeness. That he was a competent coder, but his VR stuff was above his ability to code efficiently, so he was getting help from a great coder.
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    8 years 1 month ago #29 by konzill
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    • Valentine wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Uh... wha?


    I thought it was just a snarky sort of reply.

    The true reason that GEO died is that Pokemon Go was done the right way, where you could both collect Pokemon and do battle with them via your device.


    Pokemon GO won't be done right until Petshop graduates and releases actual pokemon into the wild.
    8 years 1 month ago - 8 years 1 month ago #30 by Kettlekorn
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    • konzill wrote:

    Valentine wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Uh... wha?


    I thought it was just a snarky sort of reply.

    The true reason that GEO died is that Pokemon Go was done the right way, where you could both collect Pokemon and do battle with them via your device.


    Pokemon GO won't be done right until Petshop graduates and releases actual pokemon into the wild.

    Well, I would say that that is the point where it tips past amazingly-right directly into horribly-wrong, for several different reasons .

    That said, Pokemon is basically already a real thing: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insect_fighting
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    Last Edit: 8 years 1 month ago by Kettlekorn.
    8 years 1 month ago #31 by Kristin Darken
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    • Valentine wrote: I'd always assumed that Askey had created a VR system that would take a regular game and turn it into a VR 3D game of awesomeness. That he was a competent coder, but his VR stuff was above his ability to code efficiently, so he was getting help from a great coder.

    *nods* It's dialogue, so its not ideal grammar... but what Ayla was really saying there is:

    "I just imagined that the experience you would have using a VR rig would make any game you played while using it as good as or better than GEO." Translation: It is a devise that is used as a peripheral that interprets any game played through it as if that game were designed for VR (like the sims). The expectation being... a more immersive experience automatically makes a game better. Truthfully? I don't automatically agree with Ayla's opinion. Could the VR device make a good game better than GEO? Yes. But it would have to be a game with a rich story and good mechanics already, in which greater immersion is a benefit... otherwise, you'd just find yourself immersed in a shitty world that makes no sense.

    As to Askey's coding level or being 'comp sci' oriented -

    Most hardware/architecture people don't do the same sort of programming that game designers do. It's far more logic/engineering - driver based machine code. Most game designers work at a scripting level in a game engine designed or modified for the purpose by someone else. It's very different sorts of work... and either way you look at it, Askey's design is a DEVISE. Meaning, he can be a completely terrible coder and still make something that works. Once.

    Even in our word, claiming yourself to be a comp-sci person doesn't immediately give you ties to every other type of computer geek type out there. even just on a very general level, there are architecture, network, language design, operating systems, programmers, .... and while there are people who can do some of more than one area, the chasms between them are pretty significant.


    Anyway... the "wha?" I threw out there was more about how someone would think we introduced something as complex and integrated into multiple story lines as GEO to throw it all out the window by ending it with a random devisor generated piece of tech by a non-PoV character. The idea is actually a bit insulting (which is why JG fielded it with an anti-troll response).
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    8 years 1 month ago #32 by Kettlekorn
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    • Also, GEO could always be updated to support VR itself and thereby appropriate all of the win forever.
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    8 years 1 month ago #33 by Malady
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    • ^ That's assuming it's not already, *plugs idea that Whisper's nanites just accessed future code for VR integration*
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    8 years 1 month ago #34 by Valentine
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    • Kristin Darken wrote:

    Valentine wrote: I'd always assumed that Askey had created a VR system that would take a regular game and turn it into a VR 3D game of awesomeness. That he was a competent coder, but his VR stuff was above his ability to code efficiently, so he was getting help from a great coder.

    *nods* It's dialogue, so its not ideal grammar... but what Ayla was really saying there is:
    What Kristin wrote [ Click to expand ]


    I should have said "awesome VR 3D version of the game." Meaning even Pong is going to better using his rig, but it's still going to be Pong. But first person shooters will look as awesome as possible, but still be the same game
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    8 years 1 month ago #35 by Arcanist Lupus
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    • I've actually played augmented reality Pong. I have to agree with Valentine here - it's not going to win any gaming awards anytime soon.
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    8 years 1 month ago #36 by NJM1564
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    • konzill wrote:

    Valentine wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Uh... wha?


    I thought it was just a snarky sort of reply.

    The true reason that GEO died is that Pokemon Go was done the right way, where you could both collect Pokemon and do battle with them via your device.


    Pokemon GO won't be done right until Petshop graduates and releases actual pokemon into the wild.


    If you think about the timeline then wouldn't we be able to see Pokemon go used with the VI system. Catching hard light pokemon would be real fun.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #37 by Ametros
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    • Had a shower thought about Aunghadhail (not the sort one would typically expect) in relation to GEO.

    Unless I'm deluding myself and/or mistaking things, she lead the neutral third faction, right? As such, I'm wondering if she was using the game as a testing bed to simulate responses to her eventual reforming of the Sidhe Court. That, or possibly she was using it as a loophole to relieve pressure on her founding a nation in the real world?
    Seriously, thank you for your time and effort. It is appreciated.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Ametros.
    7 years 10 months ago #38 by Kristin Darken
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    • Or, like may people with actual leadership talent/skill who play MMOs; they end up forming their own groups/guilds/factions even when they don't WANT to. People recognize good leadership and instinctively support situations that put that leader in charge... and in return, good leaders instinctively find roles for good supporters to fill and delegate responsibilities to those who will get them done, and done well, and be happy to have done them.

    That sort of person has a tendency to have a close knit group of people around them who then want to share the experience with others... and quickly recruit guilds of people. If enough of these disciples in the inner circle actually happen to also be good players, you quickly end up with an elite force that gets recognition by the community as... a pvp force to be reckoned with, as a guild constantly doing events that engage the whole server, as a 'firsts' raiding team. Not because the individual wanted to be a leader of that sort of group... but because developing that sort of group is the sort of thing people do to show a leader that they are worth having as a friend.

    So... more than likely... Aung was just investigating things in her own way and did occasional missions and piqued the interest of a number of people who said, this would be easier if we could act outside the normal factional alignments. And someone went out and figured out a way to do it. And they moved into it as a group. Given that most castle building tends to work as part of a guild's toolbox, the establishment of the Bandit Queen's lands were just a practical option to give them neutral territory access and put them outside the normal war / attack cycle that rewarded Dark and Light for going at each other.

    And with her absence? Those lands and the organization supporting it will do one of two things, they'll rally around their 'lost' / 'missing' queen and continue to act in her name with another leader stepping in as regent... or, there won't be a leader or cause strong enough to hold it all together and it will gradually come apart... starting with a dwindling recruiting process and then as people move on conceptually, more and more will move on in other ways... returning to easier and more active groups.
    Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #39 by NJM1564
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: otherwise, you'd just find yourself immersed in a shitty world that makes no sense.


    I've read that manga!
    Someone gets shoved into a alt world based on a videogame. A buggy videogame with crap mechanics. One so bad it's deemed almost unplayable and definitely un winable. Or coarse the protagonist is the exception to that rule. :/
    I'll have to look up that manga.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by NJM1564.
    7 years 10 months ago #40 by NJM1564
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: And with her absence? Those lands and the organization supporting it will do one of two things, they'll rally around their 'lost' / 'missing' queen and continue to act in her name with another leader stepping in as regent... or, there won't be a leader or cause strong enough to hold it all together and it will gradually come apart... starting with a dwindling recruiting process and then as people move on conceptually, more and more will move on in other ways... returning to easier and more active groups.


    One of the characteristics of the game is that players avatars continue to play even if they have bin lodged off. The player Queenykins is dead but the NPC Queeny is still alive and well.
    7 years 10 months ago #41 by Malady
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    • ^^ I wanna read that manga! Or at least learn more about it...

    But, if you've read Whisper, you know what GEO thinks about Samaris(sic)...
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    7 years 10 months ago #42 by Rose Bunny
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    • When do we get Cyberkitty and Blue going all .hack//sign on GEO?
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    7 years 10 months ago #43 by NJM1564
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    • Rose Bunny wrote: When do we get Cyberkitty and Blue going all .hack//sign on GEO?


    The game is reputed to be hacker proof. And isn't safe for a cyperpath to interact with that way. It almost killed whisper.
    I also think I read in the wiki that It a device.
    7 years 10 months ago #44 by Rose Bunny
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    • True, but Paige is no ordinary hacker. This is the girl that routinely does stuff like walk around in the MCO and IRS mainframes.
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    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #45 by Kristin Darken
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    • That GEO is a devise is a common rumor, but not proven. That it is hacker-proof is also a common rumor. Also not proven... however, when the game detects alterations to its operation such as might occur even in UI modifications on a game that allows them or from hacking; the installation ceases to operate and the installation/authentication disk fails, permanently. In other words, the slightest bit of hacking detected and you have to uninstall, buy a new copy, and install from scratch. How is this done? Well... there are rumors...


    Also.. its important to note that Whisper did not hack GEO. Whisper hacked her personal computer and a field of nanites that were inhabiting her body at the time during the process of her manifestation, while playing GEO. That's an important distinction.
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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Kristin Darken.
    7 years 10 months ago #46 by Valentine
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: And with her absence? Those lands and the organization supporting it will do one of two things, they'll rally around their 'lost' / 'missing' queen and continue to act in her name with another leader stepping in as regent... or, there won't be a leader or cause strong enough to hold it all together and it will gradually come apart... starting with a dwindling recruiting process and then as people move on conceptually, more and more will move on in other ways... returning to easier and more active groups.


    Or if Nikki can log in on Aung's account, she can take over Aung's character (may not work), she can find a suitable replacement PC to take over her kingdom, she can "explain" that Aung is dead, and the PCs can decide what to do, or anyone of a number of similar things.

    Note also that Sara's demon character is also missing from play.
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    7 years 10 months ago #47 by Yolandria
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    • I think it would be hilarious to see Aung playing Geo. Her running around as a lvl 1 queen in training. " You want me to fetch you 10 rat hides! Do it your self peasent!"
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    7 years 10 months ago #48 by Valentine
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    • Yolandria wrote: I think it would be hilarious to see Aung playing Geo. Her running around as a lvl 1 queen in training. " You want me to fetch you 10 rat hides! Do it your self peasent!"


    Aung was playing GEO. She was Semiramis, the Bandit Queen. She had set up her own neutral kingdom. You need to read Whisper.
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    7 years 10 months ago #49 by Arcanist Lupus
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    • Or 'GEO Vignettes', which is where Aung's character was first established.
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    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #50 by Katssun
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    • I assumed that Aung's organization within GEO would simply be taken over by a housewife somewhere else in the US, the best MMO guild leaders in existence.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Katssun.
    7 years 10 months ago #51 by NJM1564
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    • Valentine wrote:

    Yolandria wrote: I think it would be hilarious to see Aung playing Geo. Her running around as a lvl 1 queen in training. " You want me to fetch you 10 rat hides! Do it your self peasent!"


    Aung was playing GEO. She was Semiramis, the Bandit Queen. She had set up her own neutral kingdom. You need to read Whisper.


    She couldn't have started out as a Bandit Queen. She would have started out as a Lvl 1 scrub just like anyone else.
    7 years 10 months ago #52 by Yolandria
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    • She couldn't have started out as a Bandit Queen. She would have started out as a Lvl 1 scrub just like anyone else.

    Thank you. That was the point i was making. And yes i have read all of those stories. Not to mention being a MMO player for 15+ years. I have a clue about how the process works.
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    7 years 10 months ago #53 by Kristin Darken
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    • It's an interesting point though because I don't know if Maggie ever actually established what archetype Aung's character started with. It's a classless, levelless system; so its not like it matters once you've advanced and played for a while... but it does determine what skills you learn at first (as the starting quests and training that you get are heavy into the skill reveal and building process) and how you will progress (each archetype gets a different prioritization/weighting on Exp).

    So something like a Sage or a Scout with top xp gains from exploration/discovery type events is likely. She went out of her way to avoid the default storyline, so she is unlikely to have had a large concern for RP xp, and I don't think there's ever any discussion of Seramis 'making' anything, so that nixes crafting xp. I don't think she had a combat focus... but there's probably at least some combat background given the name "Bandit Queen"... but did she have enough interest in combat to have picked something with a combat xp secondary or did she have something else secondary and combat as a third (or non-listed) and just fought because she had to not because of any real exp advantage?

    It's certainly possible that a Scout could 'seem' like a Bandit...
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    7 years 9 months ago #54 by Anne
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    • I'd think that since she's a magic user in RL she would have focused at least some of her attention to magic user in the game. Fight? Maybe. But more likely she did some assassinations and other subterfuge. She didn't have to start out big to be successful ,she just needed to consistently win, even ten rat skins at a time. Aung may not have understood this, then again she may have just been exploring and happened on a cache of magic items. Once she got enough 'followers' to justify it, a keep was almost a given.
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    7 years 9 months ago #55 by Kristin Darken
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    • There's really no distinction between magic users and 'others' in GEO though. Even your straight up soldiers have some simple magic abilities that they practice and use. They mostly aren't combat level spells, but that's beside the point.

    Anyway, that's why I said Scout or Sage... Scout and Sage are very similar archetypes. They are both exploration/discovery focused, the differences is mainly in the 'venue' of where they search for the information they gain. For scouts, its ultimately about mapping and the cartography lore. Knowing where things can be found and how to get there. For sages it an area of Lore. A sage exploring for magic lore will do most of the same things a Scout will... they just have a different critical data at the end of the search.

    And because archetypes don't define 'everything' just how you gain exp and what skills you start with... either one would work for Aung, and you could get to the same character using either route...
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    7 years 9 months ago #56 by ReiAya
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    • Valentine wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: And with her absence? Those lands and the organization supporting it will do one of two things, they'll rally around their 'lost' / 'missing' queen and continue to act in her name with another leader stepping in as regent... or, there won't be a leader or cause strong enough to hold it all together and it will gradually come apart... starting with a dwindling recruiting process and then as people move on conceptually, more and more will move on in other ways... returning to easier and more active groups.


    Or if Nikki can log in on Aung's account, she can take over Aung's character (may not work), she can find a suitable replacement PC to take over her kingdom, she can "explain" that Aung is dead, and the PCs can decide what to do, or anyone of a number of similar things.

    Note also that Sara's demon character is also missing from play.


    It would be wonderful if Nikki was able to play the account, and through one of the Fonts, she would find a new fragment of Aung's soul so she would be able to re-integrate that eventually into herself again. The GEO interface and game itself was so highly debated for how advanced it was that it is possible that perhaps a fraction of her soul still lives in the game or the character that she had created. I know she's shown up in mention in Gen 2 stories so far, but nothing has been mentioned if she has been reunited with Aung in her hollow or not.

    Also, it would truly be magnificent if she could somehow find Sara due to their blood bond and let her loose again. Since Fubar doesn't seem to be a part of the Gen 2 Cannon, she could take over some portion of the psychic arts department (to assist the Empaths, projective or otherwise, at the very least).
    7 years 9 months ago #57 by Malady
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    • IIRC, Fling's different bods could all use the same GEO Acc?
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    7 years 9 months ago - 7 years 9 months ago #58 by Rose Bunny
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    • ReiAya wrote:
    It would be wonderful if Nikki was able to play the account, and through one of the Fonts, she would find a new fragment of Aung's soul so she would be able to re-integrate that eventually into herself again. The GEO interface and game itself was so highly debated for how advanced it was that it is possible that perhaps a fraction of her soul still lives in the game or the character that she had created. I know she's shown up in mention in Gen 2 stories so far, but nothing has been mentioned if she has been reunited with Aung in her hollow or not.

    Also, it would truly be magnificent if she could somehow find Sara due to their blood bond and let her loose again. Since Fubar doesn't seem to be a part of the Gen 2 Cannon, she could take over some portion of the psychic arts department (to assist the Empaths, projective or otherwise, at the very least).

    I think everyone, including Nikki at this point, thinks that Aunghadhail returning would be a BAD thing. Yes, Nikki loved her, and was torn up by her loss...but after seeing what she was becoming due to her influence, Nikki would not want to be under it again.
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    Last Edit: 7 years 9 months ago by Rose Bunny.
    7 years 9 months ago - 7 years 9 months ago #59 by Kristin Darken
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    • Malady wrote: IIRC, Fling's different bods could all use the same GEO Acc?


    Yes. There is no problem using a character that you didn't develop... its that the UI and experience system adapts based on your personality and play style. When that playstyle changes, the character responds erratically and doesn't gain exp as quickly (because the system is confused by the input it is getting).

    Of course, playing someone elses character entirely is against most MMO EULA...and might be sufficient to trigger the anti-tamper mechanisms on the game. In that case, though, it is more likely to offer a new character creation than to lock out or 'burn' the disk. But yes, Nikki could play Aung's character... it was after all, Nikki's hands on the mouse and keyboard... even if not her conscious mind.

    As to finding Sara... Sara will be found when we need Sara to be part of the story again. Recently we had people complaining that "Well why didn't Carson take Tennyo with her... Tennyo could have handled those whatevers without breaking a sweat"... and that sort of comment is understandable. Wrong (because you don't take someone who relies on their mutant Energizer and Regen nature to hold together a body fueled by antimatter into places where the laws of physics work differently without being really desperate) but understandable. After all, she's there. And if we have someone find Sara... suddenly everything is about Sara. We don't want everything to be about Sara.

    So don't worry about trying to come up with convoluted methods of finding parts of Aung in GEO or tracing down Sara using the blood bond and so on. We don't have a problem with creative ways of bringing them back... We are, in fact, more focused on keeping them from becoming overly practical. Because a method that 'should' work would get tried eventually... and that would bring back things that we don't want back.

    In this particular case, for example... the blood bond doesn't work. It can't. If a blood bond could break a demon out of even a standard circle, that would be bad news for summoner (and demon) safety. Even normal summoning circles MUST isolate the demon from the outside ... and this one was special. No... no one is finding Sara until we've got a story that we WANT her in. And that could be a while. Or it could be next week. There's just no way to know. :)
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    Last Edit: 7 years 9 months ago by Kristin Darken.
    7 years 9 months ago #60 by Otherself
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: Recently we had people complaining that "Well why didn't Carson take Tennyo with her... Tennyo could have handled those whatevers without breaking a sweat"... and that sort of comment is understandable. Wrong (because you don't take someone who relies on their mutant Energizer and Regen nature to hold together a body fueled by antimatter into places where the laws of physics work differently without being really desperate) but understandable.


    Sigh..... I was told to drop it so I did, but it seems that I still haven't managed to explain what I was trying to say, the point wasn't "Why not bringing Tennyo in?" but"Why does everyone act like she doesn't exist?". I can get keeping her existance quiet to avoid incidents like the one in NORAD, but when you have people who are tasked to keep Cthulhu sealed in its can you you would think they would be informed about her (maybe under a sorcerer contract to keep them from fucking up) so that when the Godzilla Treshold is reached she can be factored in.... IF she's aviable (yes E.E. I do remeber of that Iso-ship of hers). And Carson DOES know, at the end she was like "And if it manages to break out of the poket universe I trapped it in, hopefully the same system that just failed to keep it contained will manage to be enough".... That bugged me, not that Tennyo isn't there but the fact that everyone acted as unaware of her existance, I mean, all it would have taken was Carson to say "Hopefully Tennyo will be aviable if it ever manages to break out of the poket universe". I get that having her in the story would have destroyed it but she's still part of the universe, aknowleding her existance wouldn't have ruined it.

    But back to GEO, Fey lost much when she lost Aung, could it affect her muscle memory as well? Also, the game has a magical component at its core, could it recognize when someone is playing someone else's character? Could it Consider Nikki and Aung different persons?
    7 years 9 months ago #61 by Phoenix Spiritus
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    • Otherself wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Recently we had people complaining that "Well why didn't Carson take Tennyo with her... Tennyo could have handled those whatevers without breaking a sweat"... and that sort of comment is understandable. Wrong (because you don't take someone who relies on their mutant Energizer and Regen nature to hold together a body fueled by antimatter into places where the laws of physics work differently without being really desperate) but understandable.


    Sigh..... I was told to drop it so I did, but it seems that I still haven't managed to explain what I was trying to say, the point wasn't "Why not bringing Tennyo in?" but"Why does everyone act like she doesn't exist?"


    Its not that she doesn't exist, its that there is a very fine line between "Something is bad enough that Tennyo will be helpful" and the point where Tennyo is making everything worse.

    When going into a situation where it's all marginal to begin with, Tennyo is usually "to much bother" to take. She has too many unknowns. Is WAY too powerful and causes all sorts of long term unknown issues.

    In a complicated situation, its just easier to stay with the knowns.
    7 years 9 months ago #62 by JG
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    • sending a PM to not derail topic
    7 years 9 months ago #63 by Valentine
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    • Well GEO has lost some of its best players in less than a year. Whisper, Aung, Sara, and Hamper or Damper (whichever of the twins it was).
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    7 years 9 months ago - 7 years 9 months ago #64 by Kristin Darken
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    • Most of these people wouldn't be classed as 'best players' by an MMO community, you know? They ALL have far too much happening in the rest of their lives for their GEO presence to even class them in the top 100 on a given server.

    Whisper wasn't even much more than a name association for a council of Light side guild leaders, except for her own guild's officers. The Council (which didn't necessarily represent the strongest guilds, just the strongest collection of guilds, who 'combined' control the status of a Font). But Whisper personally? Brian - Kid, in high school. Even if he does nothing else with his out of school time, that means any 'adult' hardcore player automatically has at least a 6-8 hr per day advantage over him. And he doesn't have complete freedom to play all the time when he's at home, if you look at how his family treats his playing. He gets the freedom to stay up and finish what he's doing 'sometimes' but they're still aware of it and there's no sense that he ignores everything else to do nothing but play.

    Aung got a couple hours an evening from Nikki, at best. As I've said earlier, I guarantee to you... most of the things you give the "Bandit Queen" credit for... someone in her circle of guild officers was actually responsible for. Name recognition? Probably, because the neutral faction would be a community affecting factor... but I'd bet more of them would recognize the title "Bandit Queen" than her character name, Seramis.

    Hamper and Damper? Again, school kids playing a game in their spare time. No kid going to Whateley has the kind of time to be a top tier player of anything. Even if they are crazy good. They simply don't have the time to sink into the game that would be built in there.

    Sara... of any of them, Sara has the most potential to be a recognized power player within the GEO community. Partly because of the role she plays, which makes her someone to be aware of and protect yourself against. Partly because, unlike the other students of Whateley, Sara doesn't need sleep. And that gives her the potential to use the time the average hardcore player would sleeping to compensate for the fact she has daytime class commitments that they do not. However... I think that's just potential. I think Sara DOES play several hours a night, which gives her an advantage over a lot of the other student players... but I don't think she commits all her offtime to playing. She was always interacting with other students (and adults) both at Whateley and at ARC... and elsewhere. She has followers and lovers and assassins, her own combat team, and so on. Even for Sara, that takes 'time'.

    Just on a rough guess:
    Aung would be classed as a casual player. <20 hrs a week. Doesn't pursue any of the main progression activities.
    Whisper would be classed as a standard raiders. They play 20-40 hrs a week, half of that working on development and preparation work for their character, half involved in group dungeon/raid activities that progress the main game storyline.
    Hamper/Damper would be classed as standard PvP'ers. They play 20-40 hrs a week focused on character development and participating in player hunting/killing activities or the occasional assassination.
    Sara would be a hardcore or progression raider. These players spend 10-20 hrs quickly collecting resources and ensuring that their characters are prepared for progression raid activities and then spend 30-40 hrs per week working on completing as many of the newest raids available to players.

    None of these are likely to be in a top guild or a 'firsts' guild which consistently is the first or fastest to complete the newest content. If for any other reason than that Those guilds start raiding the moment content opens. And that usually means Tuesday mornings following upgrade patches... and then all day, or as long as they can function for the first couple days in the week... and when they can't progress further, then they go back and farm the easier earlier content. Other guilds raid when most of their players can be online - evenings, weekends, etc.

    Generally, the 100 most known players will be top half of each of the top several guilds and then four or five of the top people from each of the other guilds in the top ten or so guilds. It may dip lower if several of the top guilds don't include a player using a certain class or type of play. And then... there might be another 30-50 players who are recognized for their expertise in Lore or crafting or some other aspect of play that doesn't necessarily require being a progression raider. For instance, a fellow named Equinox on my server in WoW... was never around a lot, wouldn't have been considered much more than a casual even just on our server... but became a known figure game wide (across hundreds of servers) because he created a popular cartoon/comic series based on his adventures. Some people are known because of their help in global chat... or their asshole nature.

    And THAT is where Seramis and Marala are likely to have fame or notoriety. And maybe Whisper to a lesser degree. Not because they're considered top players, but because their 'story' has become a part of lore.
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    Last Edit: 7 years 9 months ago by Kristin Darken.
    7 years 9 months ago #65 by NJM1564
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: Most of these people wouldn't be classed as 'best players' by an MMO community, you know? They ALL have far too much happening in the rest of their lives for their GEO presence to even class them in the top 100 on a given server.


    In any real game maybe. But GEO has the players avatar continue to play after they log off. They learn from the player and play accordingly. Someone with Queenykins strong personality could influence her avatar enough to keep up appearances even with her absence despite only playing a few hours a day.
    7 years 9 months ago #66 by JG
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    • NJM1564 wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Most of these people wouldn't be classed as 'best players' by an MMO community, you know? They ALL have far too much happening in the rest of their lives for their GEO presence to even class them in the top 100 on a given server.


    In any real game maybe. But GEO has the players avatar continue to play after they log off. They learn from the player and play accordingly. Someone with Queenykins strong personality could influence her avatar enough to keep up appearances even with her absence despite only playing a few hours a day.


    But this doesn't mean that the Game keeps up their activities with the quality of style and pace that the players themselves bring to the table.

    It's keeping them in play via effigy. The Effigy would likely not be the match for the reality.
    7 years 9 months ago #67 by NJM1564
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    • JG wrote:

    NJM1564 wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: Most of these people wouldn't be classed as 'best players' by an MMO community, you know? They ALL have far too much happening in the rest of their lives for their GEO presence to even class them in the top 100 on a given server.


    In any real game maybe. But GEO has the players avatar continue to play after they log off. They learn from the player and play accordingly. Someone with Queenykins strong personality could influence her avatar enough to keep up appearances even with her absence despite only playing a few hours a day.


    But this doesn't mean that the Game keeps up their activities with the quality of style and pace that the players themselves bring to the table.

    It's keeping them in play via effigy. The Effigy would likely not be the match for the reality.


    Who knows. GEO is a bonkers crazy game in every way imaginable. It is so much impossible at every level. It could very well accurately reproduce a players actions and continue them on indefinitely.
    7 years 9 months ago #68 by Kristin Darken
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    • No... sorry. The offline play feature isn't an alternate for a player, it operates based on settings that you assign it on log out. It can set up a standard camp, it can go to ground or hide, it can continue to travel along a known route, it can pursue a known gathering skill within a limited range, it can use available facilities to train (training can be limited to a specific category of skill or left open).

    It will do these things with some awareness towards the survival and progression of the character. For instance, it might pursue a local gathering effort or continue to travel; but if a creature wanders into the location, it will use the same level of caution that the player normal shows when facing such things. Meaning, if you're the sort that normally dives in without showing concern over the strength of your opponent... the offline version of the character will do the same. And if it is being defeated, it will flee with the same level of concern/caution as you normally do.

    If you tell it to set up camp or go to ground, it will use more caution and only engage if it cannot stay in safety and it will act as defensively as possible. If it can find more safety by moving to a nearby location, it may... but, only risk of death will make it override the command to set up camp or hide. The other actions tend to have more flexibility in 'end' location.

    But while this is way more beneficial to a player than just being offline... and does benefit from the AI and learning qualities of the game... its still nothing like the player being there. Sure... in an ultimate, idealized version of the game, that would be a goal worth shooting for... but its not something I expected even the GEO version to achieve. Sorry. :)
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    7 years 9 months ago #69 by Anne
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    • I don't think that this thread is about Tennyo, however one reason that she has become a background character is that her author is among those whom are missing.
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    7 years 1 day ago #70 by Cryptic
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    • there any thing like the Draenei race in geo?
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    6 years 11 months ago #71 by Kristin Darken
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    • Not really. Remember, everyone plays human in GEO. You can only depart from human by use of power (typically Font based quests but also necromancy and one or two other options). So no... no space goats. Could someone theoretically pursue Font based transformations to end up a faun or something similar? Possibly. Most Light side transformations are more inclined towards specialized ability sets instead of physical transformations. Dark side, obviously, tend to have more monsterization power-ups.
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    6 years 11 months ago #72 by Cryptic
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    • Ah, thanks. that's a tid bit I hadn't picked up on. WoW reference it is then.

    geo still around in some form for gen2?
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    6 years 11 months ago #73 by Malady
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    • GEO doesn't seem to be a thing in Gen2.

    As said on Page 1:

    Kristin Darken wrote: By the time Gen 2 rolls around, the gaming industry has recovered and has moved on to a different variety of games (much as has most of our own world's game industry).
    ...
    As to GEO specifically... while you will find some MMO's... even some in a fantasy setting... the public STILL hasn't recovered from the GEO incident, and old players will tell you...

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    6 years 11 months ago #74 by Sir Lee
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    • How many MMPORGS lasted ten years on the top of the market? As groundbreaking as GEO was, I expect that eventually some newer game overshadowed it.
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    6 years 11 months ago #75 by Kristin Darken
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    • GEO is definitely not around in Gen 2... though at that point everyone knows about it (as the nail in the coffin of fantasy MMO's and even RPG's). The mobile games market has already crested as the dominant gaming medium and has a potential for resurgence through use of holographic projection and hard light systems like the GridGear. But the new 'edge' gaming market is FPS using hard light arenas. In fact, FPS and sports style games have been the dominant game type in the market since 2008... puzzle/arcade/strategy style as second tier. No one plays fantasy RPGs and especially not MMO's since then... not after what happened with GEO.
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    6 years 11 months ago #76 by Hardric
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: GEO is definitely not around in Gen 2... though at that point everyone knows about it (as the nail in the coffin of fantasy MMO's and even RPG's). The mobile games market has already crested as the dominant gaming medium and has a potential for resurgence through use of holographic projection and hard light systems like the GridGear. But the new 'edge' gaming market is FPS using hard light arenas. In fact, FPS and sports style games have been the dominant game type in the market since 2008... puzzle/arcade/strategy style as second tier. No one plays fantasy RPGs and especially not MMO's since then... not after what happened with GEO.


    *Spitake*WHAT? *thinks to all the fantasy RPGs, tabletop and videos and things they inspired I remember since 2008* How, how could something like that even happen? I literally can't imagine something so bad to create an outcome as impossible as this one (one nefarious game to kill all fantasy RPGs... Boy, the loonies haters of the genre must have had a field day). How well are going things with urban fantasy, sci-fi, tactical RPG, and the likes (Please let the Persona, Shin Megami Tensei and Fire Emblem franchises survive...)?

    And if 2008 is really the date, you killed fantasy RPGs the year of Gary Gygax death! What sort of insanely fucked-up world is that? Speaking of things I literally cannot imagine... I'd want a totally civilized and friendly conversation with GEO's creator, or whatever insane AI/person used it to the purpose which led to that outcome...
    6 years 11 months ago #77 by Kristin Darken
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    • Hardric wrote: And if 2008 is really the date, you killed fantasy RPGs the year of Gary Gygax death!

    Well, in all fairness... I didn't KNOW that Gygax was going to die in 2008 when I came up with the concept. ;)
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    6 years 11 months ago #78 by Hardric
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    • Kristin Darken wrote:

    Hardric wrote: And if 2008 is really the date, you killed fantasy RPGs the year of Gary Gygax death!

    Well, in all fairness... I didn't KNOW that Gygax was going to die in 2008 when I came up with the concept. ;)


    Well, at least real life lent more weight to that plot point once it's reached... And it has to be worst for Dave Arneson, he dies in 2009, so he actually sees the genre dies (assuming it happened after 4th March 2008...).

    I've got one last thing to add:
    6 years 11 months ago #79 by null0trooper
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    • Hardric wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote:

    Hardric wrote: And if 2008 is really the date, you killed fantasy RPGs the year of Gary Gygax death!

    Well, in all fairness... I didn't KNOW that Gygax was going to die in 2008 when I came up with the concept. ;)


    Well, at least real life lent more weight to that plot point once it's reached... And it has to be worst for Dave Arneson, he dies in 2009, so he actually sees the genre dies (assuming it happened after 4th March 2008...).


    I understood Kristin's statement about the fantasy RPGs dying out to refer to the online RPGs and not necessarily the tabletop and miniatures games. Or is it across-the-board? However, I wonder how popular games like Champions would be in a world in which supers are people who can be pestered for autographs.
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    6 years 11 months ago #80 by Valentine
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    • null0trooper wrote:

    Hardric wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote:

    Hardric wrote: And if 2008 is really the date, you killed fantasy RPGs the year of Gary Gygax death!

    Well, in all fairness... I didn't KNOW that Gygax was going to die in 2008 when I came up with the concept. ;)


    Well, at least real life lent more weight to that plot point once it's reached... And it has to be worst for Dave Arneson, he dies in 2009, so he actually sees the genre dies (assuming it happened after 4th March 2008...).


    I understood Kristin's statement about the fantasy RPGs dying out to refer to the online RPGs and not necessarily the tabletop and miniatures games. Or is it across-the-board? However, I wonder how popular games like Champions would be in a world in which supers are people who can be pestered for autographs.


    I imagine amongst the gamers it would be popular, except amongst H1! types. There would be lots of forums on how to build an accurate Captain Patriot, with all the ensuing arguments. After all RPGs are playing something you aren't.

    There are a few modern RPGs, and others set in the near future or recent past. They aren't as popular as fantasy games, but they are around.
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    6 years 11 months ago #81 by Kristin Darken
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    • Yes, I was referring specifically to computer RPGs... but in all seriousness, it would probably have hurt the tabletop market and film/entertainment industry as well. Mainly because it was their target audience that was most affected by the...














    ya... still not going to spoiler it. ;)
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    6 years 11 months ago - 6 years 11 months ago #82 by Malady
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    • ... Who is the target audience of films and tabletops??

    Any of the Big Bads (HM, Bastard, Etc), responsible for GEO??

    GEO and its connection to Magic, speculation [ Click to expand ]
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    Last Edit: 6 years 11 months ago by Malady.
    6 years 11 months ago #83 by Sir Lee
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    • GEO magic system is a copy of the Whateley magic system because you don't want to overwork the willing suspension of disbelief. It's the same reason that you don't write a setting where physics laws work very differently from the real world, like say the light being just a little faster than sound. Yeah, Terry Pratchett did say that light in the Discworld is slow... and then promptly ignored it unless in the context of a specific joke.

    Thing is, in the Whateley universe you can go online and find out a lot of things about how magic works. Not everything, but still a lot. So you can assume that a fair share of RPG players will be obsessive enough to research it. So you don't go out of your way to contradict what "everybody knows" about magic; you start from what is generally known or easily researched about magic in the "real world" and tweak the more obscure points to serve your gaming/storytelling needs, in the same way that E.E. "Doc" Smith basically ignored Relativity (and hung a lampshade on it) in his Lensman books, but kept the Newtonian physics consistent.
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    6 years 10 months ago - 6 years 10 months ago #84 by Malady
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    • Just rediscovered that Damper was expelled from Whateley and was playing as Shadow Killer... I wonder if his expulsion means that we're not gonna see him on GEO anymore...

    I guess, since they had criminal charges, they're in prison... So, yeah, no GEO for them.

    Well, there's the game playing their characters for them, so there's that...

    Lol at someone just booting up a single character and letting it idle to see what happens.

    ...

    Wonder if Make and Overclock, who we haven't heard about in forever, play GEO, like presumably a lot of the computer tech set...
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    6 years 10 months ago #85 by CrazyMinh
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    • Anne wrote: I don't think that this thread is about Tennyo, however one reason that she has become a background character is that her author is among those whom are missing.


    Does anyone actually know whether Starwolf is still alive??? Their last story was published a long, long time ago. Do any of the authors/staff actually know if they are still breathing??? Or are they in a shallow grave somewhere??? Bit morbid, but had to ask. If so, what does that mean for the copyright (cause right now copyright expires 50 years after the author's death, and keeps getting pushed by the f**kers at Disney. I mean, seriously. NO ONE even remotely CARES whether Mickey frakkin mouse becomes Public Domain or not. I mean, it's like hanging onto a mouldy sock because you rather liked it when you were a teenager, even though there isn't a matching one to go with it, and it has holes large enough for small potatoes to fit through, and smells more rancid than a hick after a three-week stag night in Las Vegas. A hick who hasn't showered the entire time, and spent a lot of it in bed.
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    6 years 10 months ago #86 by Sir Lee
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    • Leaving aside the matter relating to the Whateley authors and focusing on the copyright/trademark issues...

    Well, obviously Disney cares. And you may not care about Mickey Mouse, but the characters make a bundle for Disney every year. And why does Disney care about the copyright on an old, black-and-white, silent cartoon featuring a proto-Mickey from almost a century ago that only a few enthusiasts ever bother to watch?

    The answer is simple: derivative works rights. If that first Mickey cartoon enters public domain, Disney still has valid copyrights over later works (until they expire themselves, that is) -- but they lose the monopoly on creating new works featuring Mickey Mouse.

    Well, they probably will retain the Mickey Mouse trademark, so other producers probably wouldn't be able to feature Mickey prominently on the title or cover of whatever they do... but they could use Mickey as a "guest star' with no problems.

    Corporations hate losing monopolies.
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    6 years 10 months ago #87 by Kettlekorn
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    • CrazyMinh wrote: Does anyone actually know whether Starwolf is still alive??? Their last story was published a long, long time ago.

    Starwolf popped into the forum two and a half years ago to say hi. I don't know about since then.
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    6 years 10 months ago #88 by Kristin Darken
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    • There are enough threads already in the forums that include discussions of which authors we are in contact with, which we have sporadic contact with, and which have been off the grid completely for a period of time. Some of the more involved discussions of the issue (and copyrights) can be found in the fanfic/whatif writers forums because, not surprisingly, copyright is more an issue of concern for authors than for readers. Let's put any further conversation about 'that' in the appropriate thread... instead of in a thread about GEO which was created by an author who IS still present.
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    6 years 8 months ago #89 by RoseBlack
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    • My pet theory is geo is leeching essence from people and the "spell runes" it teaches them are what it's using to do it. I mean you have the will for something to happen even if it is only for your character (which as we know from several stories people lose essence all the time wishing for things.) And a action your using to attempt to express that will/desire. (Which we have been told is how casting works which is why people can create their own spells that do the exact same thing as another spell more or less.) And that this may end up with a bunch of baby magi running around after as they by playing geo will have trained their will to some degree to only use essence when they do certain things because the game trained them too. Of course they won't build up much essence from day to day life and some the "training" won't take on. But when GEO has granted the wish of the ones who made it maybe we will see more wiz-0 mages.

    Now what they are doing with all this free essence they are gathering that I have no idea. That's gonna be the thing that attracts attention though not all the half trained magi. Honestly they would likely just end up being more successful or something maybe because they can focus what little essence they get by day to day life better on the things they want. (Ref. The Secret type stuff)

    Please feel free to tear apart.
    6 years 8 months ago #90 by CrazyMinh
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    • RoseBlack wrote: My pet theory is geo is leeching essence from people and the "spell runes" it teaches them are what it's using to do it. I mean you have the will for something to happen even if it is only for your character (which as we know from several stories people lose essence all the time wishing for things.) And a action your using to attempt to express that will/desire. (Which we have been told is how casting works which is why people can create their own spells that do the exact same thing as another spell more or less.) And that this may end up with a bunch of baby magi running around after as they by playing geo will have trained their will to some degree to only use essence when they do certain things because the game trained them too. Of course they won't build up much essence from day to day life and some the "training" won't take on. But when GEO has granted the wish of the ones who made it maybe we will see more wiz-0 mages.

    Now what they are doing with all this free essence they are gathering that I have no idea. That's gonna be the thing that attracts attention though not all the half trained magi. Honestly they would likely just end up being more successful or something maybe because they can focus what little essence they get by day to day life better on the things they want. (Ref. The Secret type stuff)

    Please feel free to tear apart.


    This is...decent, but I feel like there's something wrong with it. I'll have to reread the GEO stories. Anyone else want to have a crack at this? No offence RB, but there is something 'off' about this theory, but I can't remember what for the life of me.
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    6 years 8 months ago #91 by Valentine
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    • Wouldn't Aung or Nikki or some other mage have noticed the drain? The mage in Whisper noticed the spells on the keyboard and mouse right off.
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    6 years 8 months ago #92 by CrazyMinh
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    • Valentine wrote: Wouldn't Aung or Nikki or some other mage have noticed the drain? The mage in Whisper noticed the spells on the keyboard and mouse right off.


    Thank you!!! THAT'S what I was forgetting.

    What I was missing from my memory was that particular fact. If a sufficiently powerful mage can notice a simple spell on a keyboard and mouse, then it would have to be very, very stealthy magic to draw without notice. Plus, Nikki or other Ley-line seeing individuals (or Jinn with her aura vision, or anyone else who can see a person's aura) would notice the effects. It would be very hard to have such a spell in operation with three million plus players globally, many of whom don't have lit essence wells (making it not worth the effort), and only some of which are powerful mages. To expend such essence on a spell affecting that many individual people, and only getting a worthwhile return from maybe a handful of players would be a tremendous waste of time.

    My money is on the GEO mainframe turning out to be a group of hive-mind linked prisoners, kinda like the evil repair station in the ST: Enterprise episode Dead Stop. That would probably turn public opinion enough to cause a bad name to come upon MMORPG games.

    On another note, does that said MMO stigma mean that FPSMMO games like Destiny and Warframe wouldn't exist as well??? Or extend to games which have both RPG elements and MMO elements, but fall more in the category of a shared-universe coop game (Path of Exile for example?)

    Forgive me, but as a gamer, it doesn't seem like anything not involving human torture, kidnap, extortion, isekai-anime-style incidents (like 5000 people dying in real life while in a video game for no reason at all or all the players of a MMO disappearing and assuming the roles of their character for example), TRON-style mindf**kery, Matrix-style mindf**kery, any sort of mindf**kery, death, disease, basically the entire script of Pixels (WHY DOES THAT MOVIE EXIST!!!)...There are a lot of scenarios, but a lot of them don't really fit the theme or setting of the WU, and the others are...let's say unlikely candidates. I can only really think of three or four scenarios in which a event can conceivably damage the industry so much and in such a dramatic way (as we've been lead to believe). Just in case I turn out to be right about one of them (in which case, when the said story is released, I will be saying 'I didn't tell you so, but I knew it so' (you can quote me on that in the eventual story discussion post), I won't be adding them here. Mainly because if I did I could potentially limit the options available (you do know that the authors will change the events they have planned if anyone actually manages to hit exactly on what they were planning, if there is no other option but to go with the one option) and...

    I'm rambling. Please forgive me. I know not of the laws of sanity. Good night, WU. Good Night.
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    6 years 8 months ago #93 by RoseBlack
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    • Ah but they have already noticed that part of geo interface with the person uses magic iirc. Also a trained mage would never be drained in my theory because they already have control. It would just be the hoipoi that would be drained because their wishes always cause them to bleed essence anyways. Ref the three little witches in one story it talks about how they were given essence and stood their wishing for things and talking about what they wanted to do with it and every time they did a bit more leaked away til they had nothing left. GEO is collecting that. Not draining like Sarah after life force. And the mind would come to associate the motions on the game with wanting to release essence for anyone who isn't already trained. So a mage would again never be drained because they already control their essence and thus would not be leaking essence to geo to begin with.
    6 years 8 months ago #94 by Hebblejebble
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    • IIRC the usefulness of draining magical power from normal folk is described in the 'Silent Nacht' stories with spirits or beginning mages forming cults to do so. The trick seems to be to get enough people to focus their efforts/thoughts on a concept or idea you can associate yourself with and thus draw power from. Given the popularity of GEO and the devotion players can show to a MMORPG their should be more than enough potential power available to make such a scheme worthwhile. The reason this hasn't been a problem before is that (almost) no-one seems to knows how to channel magic through a computer network.

    This kind of setup could have any number of motives behind it, even as simple as keeping the magical user interface in GEO running, or the designer working off the principal of more power = more better.
    6 years 8 months ago #95 by CrazyMinh
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    • What about a ADHD mage???

    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    . . .
    . . .

    . . .


    That was possibly the most scary thought I have ever had. My god...
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    6 years 8 months ago #96 by null0trooper
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    • CrazyMinh wrote: What about a ADHD mage???


    For example?

    Watching the kid mentally shift - and grind - gears like that, Abbie could almost smell the adderall prescription on him. There was something about him that seemed familiar. It wasn't just the reflexive friend-or-foe appraisal the bullied (she'd seen that look before on too many of her friends back home) boy gave her. She stood her ground and waited: three, two, one ...

    "Whatever it was," the boy squeaked, "I am completely innocent. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!"


    See? That wasn't so scary!

    Not until at least a couple more chapters.
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    6 years 8 months ago #97 by Anne
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    • Hebblejebble wrote: IIRC the usefulness of draining magical power from normal folk is described in the 'Silent Nacht' stories with spirits or beginning mages forming cults to do so. The trick seems to be to get enough people to focus their efforts/thoughts on a concept or idea you can associate yourself with and thus draw power from. Given the popularity of GEO and the devotion players can show to a MMORPG their should be more than enough potential power available to make such a scheme worthwhile. The reason this hasn't been a problem before is that (almost) no-one seems to knows how to channel magic through a computer network.

    This kind of setup could have any number of motives behind it, even as simple as keeping the magical user interface in GEO running, or the designer working off the principal of more power = more better.

    This is really shown well in gen 2. Smokey [the dragnet (I forget what his owner's name is)] and his boy (the boy is the son of the witch queen IIRC) are familiar with this as noted by me here in that the boy's mother runs a 'magic cult' that essentially harvests the essence of the believers to her benefit.
    So to probably do 'gods' harvest the essence released by worship. The more worshipers a 'god' has the more powerful the 'god' will be to a certain extent.
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    6 years 8 months ago #98 by Astrodragon
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    • CrazyMinh wrote: What about a ADHD mage???

    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    ...
    . . .
    . . .

    . . .


    That was possibly the most scary thought I have ever had. My god...


    So Mages with PTSD are fine then?
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    6 years 8 months ago #99 by RoseBlack
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    • See I'm not completely wrong about this XD.

    Honestly in my mind some it goes into the interface and some goes into a dev battery.

    Would also explain the font concept in the game they give tangible benefits for devoting yourself to light or dark and keeping a focus on that. Might be why the game hated Seramis so much she was making it less polarized cause if you can go over here and do whatever you don't have to focus on your characters devotion. Thus making it harder to pry essence out of your nonawakened tail.
    6 years 8 months ago - 6 years 8 months ago #100 by Schol-R-LEA
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    • CrazyMinh wrote: What about a ADHD mage???

    That was possibly the most scary thought I have ever had. My god...


    I would consider an insane one - by which I mean something similar to what Mage: The Ascension called a 'Marauder', a mage who bends reality around them to fit their delusions without even realizing it - far scarier.

    In the game, unlike most mages, Marauders don't usually suffer directly from Paradox backlash (a response by mundane reality and belief in same that tries to resist or even undo the effects of magic), with most of the Paradox they accumulate getting dumped onto everyone around them - especially other mages.

    Worse, one Paradox effect that does strike Marauders is that they tend to fade in and out of the Tellurian (physical reality as most people know it), and when they do they sometimes drag unwitting victims along with them across the Gauntlet (the barrier separating realities) into the Shadow (a sort of Astral plane which touches the physical one, but can't directly interact with it) or even out past the Horizon (a higher-level Gauntlet which encapsulates the realms closest to the Tellurian) to get trapped out in incomprehensible dimensions.

    For example, there was one who (IIRC) was simply known as The Lost Marine, who Awakened during the Vietnam War; he is now in a state of near-constant PTSD, which causes his surroundings to turn into a jungle at twilight, with artillery shells and bombs going off all around, and phantom Vietnamese soldiers chasing him while gunning down any bystanders unfortunate enough to be seen by them. The jungle, explosions, and pursuers could be considered hallucinations by some, but the death and destruction they cause are quite real.
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    6 years 8 months ago #101 by Kristin Darken
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    • Valentine wrote: Wouldn't Aung or Nikki or some other mage have noticed the drain? The mage in Whisper noticed the spells on the keyboard and mouse right off.


    Human mages and even many mutant mages don't inherently have an ability to 'see' magick. It's one of things most learn early on in spell crafting... create a light, draw essence, push essence, mage-sight... often in that order. After all, there's no specific reason that your 'awareness' of essence and manipulated spell energy should specifically be a factor of 'vision'. And magick as a whole would be exceptionally useless for a variety of things (hiding, traps, subtle coercion, surprise defenses/attacks, etc) if the energy of active spellcraft was visible in operation.

    As far as the followup testing on Whisper's computer... a mage would have found that that magick was heavily attuned to healing purposes... and possibly also scrying. In other words, likely after effects of Aung's Poison cleansing and Healing, and her attempts to look in on Whisper to make sure she's all right. After all, Nikki pushed enough magick through that system to allow Whispers manifestation from human to Sidhe nearly instantaneously. Nick's transformation too time and active use of magick to complete (remember, humans are organic while elves are composed of more Essence oriented materials). Even an active nanobot swarm isn't going to change a human to an elf... looks? yes... but the real thing? Nope.


    But yes... actively searching Brenda's computer for traces of magick? Or any other long time player? Will indeed find varying levels of active spellcraft. Unknown types. Super complex and unknown. And even Sidhe mages will be impressed that something that complex can be active with such small traces of energy involved.

    But no... there does not appear to be any active Essence flow from gamers to the system or any external storage.

    The traces, whatever they are or actually do... appear for all purposes to simply enhance the game's interface. So yes... some people are curious... but there doesn't seem to be anything about the system to concern anyone...
    Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.
    6 years 8 months ago #102 by CrazyMinh
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    • Kristin Darken wrote:

    Valentine wrote: Wouldn't Aung or Nikki or some other mage have noticed the drain? The mage in Whisper noticed the spells on the keyboard and mouse right off.


    Human mages and even many mutant mages don't inherently have an ability to 'see' magick. It's one of things most learn early on in spell crafting... create a light, draw essence, push essence, mage-sight... often in that order. After all, there's no specific reason that your 'awareness' of essence and manipulated spell energy should specifically be a factor of 'vision'. And magick as a whole would be exceptionally useless for a variety of things (hiding, traps, subtle coercion, surprise defenses/attacks, etc) if the energy of active spellcraft was visible in operation.

    As far as the followup testing on Whisper's computer... a mage would have found that that magick was heavily attuned to healing purposes... and possibly also scrying. In other words, likely after effects of Aung's Poison cleansing and Healing, and her attempts to look in on Whisper to make sure she's all right. After all, Nikki pushed enough magick through that system to allow Whispers manifestation from human to Sidhe nearly instantaneously. Nick's transformation too time and active use of magick to complete (remember, humans are organic while elves are composed of more Essence oriented materials). Even an active nanobot swarm isn't going to change a human to an elf... looks? yes... but the real thing? Nope.


    But yes... actively searching Brenda's computer for traces of magick? Or any other long time player? Will indeed find varying levels of active spellcraft. Unknown types. Super complex and unknown. And even Sidhe mages will be impressed that something that complex can be active with such small traces of energy involved.

    But no... there does not appear to be any active Essence flow from gamers to the system or any external storage.

    The traces, whatever they are or actually do... appear for all purposes to simply enhance the game's interface. So yes... some people are curious... but there doesn't seem to be anything about the system to concern anyone...


    Said in classic DM style. Not explicitly telling you if your roll was correct, but not denying that there is nothing interesting about it either.
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    6 years 7 months ago #103 by RoseBlack
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    • Hey atleast I'm kinda vaguely barking up the right tree or atleast one if the same species lol.
    6 years 7 months ago #104 by Ametros
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: The traces, whatever they are or actually do... appear for all purposes to simply enhance the game's interface. So yes... some people are curious... but there doesn't seem to be anything about the system to concern anyone...


    This seems to answer (or at least clarify) a few questions regarding GEO.

    So naturally, the biggest question is when we, the audience, might see more of you and GEO. Is there anything we might be able to bribe you and/or your muse with?
    Seriously, thank you for your time and effort. It is appreciated.
    6 years 7 months ago #105 by CrazyMinh
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    • Ametros wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: The traces, whatever they are or actually do... appear for all purposes to simply enhance the game's interface. So yes... some people are curious... but there doesn't seem to be anything about the system to concern anyone...


    This seems to answer (or at least clarify) a few questions regarding GEO.

    So naturally, the biggest question is when we, the audience, might see more of you and GEO. Is there anything we might be able to bribe you and/or your muse with?


    We could try baked goods??? Or we could try hash cookies???

    Note that I am NOT endorsing the use or creation of Hash Cookies. Hard drugs are NOT something anyone should get into, nor are they acceptable things to bribe others with. Indigestion of Hash cookies or other forms of drugs will result in a brief high, followed by unwanted and unneeded side effects. This message was bought to you by Googling 'Hash cookies', and by the Crazy Minh Is Always Right Foundation.
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    6 years 7 months ago - 6 years 7 months ago #106 by Sir Lee
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    • "Indigestion" of hash cookies? I would think that indigestion of anything would have unpleasant side effects.
    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    Last Edit: 6 years 7 months ago by Sir Lee.
    6 years 7 months ago #107 by CrazyMinh
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    • Sir Lee wrote: "Indigestion" of hash cookies? I would think that indigestion of anything would have unpleasant side effects.


    Sorry Herr Grammer-Nazi. I meant Ingestion.

    Bloody hell. Next, it'll be genocide of infinitive splitting. Though STD has already done that ;)
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    6 years 7 months ago - 6 years 7 months ago #108 by Kristin Darken
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    • It's a story site. Of course people are going to call you on incorrect word usage. Especially when its a FUNNY one. :) And the last thing you want to do as someone with an interest in writing is to start calling editorial minded people names. We like our editors. We NEED our editors. :-p
    Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.
    Last Edit: 6 years 7 months ago by Kristin Darken.
    6 years 7 months ago #109 by CrazyMinh
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    • Kristin Darken wrote: It's a story site. Of course people are going to call you on incorrect word usage. Especially when its a FUNNY one. :) And the last thing you want to do as someone with an interest in writing is to start calling editorial minded people names. We like our editors. We NEED our editors. :-p


    So...no interest in the Hash Cookies???
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    6 years 7 months ago - 6 years 7 months ago #110 by Schol-R-LEA
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    • CrazyMinh wrote:

    Kristin Darken wrote: It's a story site. Of course people are going to call you on incorrect word usage. Especially when its a FUNNY one. :) And the last thing you want to do as someone with an interest in writing is to start calling editorial minded people names. We like our editors. We NEED our editors. :-p


    So...no interest in the Hash Cookies???

    That depends on the hash the server is signing the cookies with, you don't want to use one that is known to be insecure... ;)

    Oh, the other kind of hash cookies? Well, it's been a while since... uhm, please forget that I said that.





    Though to be honest, that isn't really my drug of choice:


    That's right - I'm a clip show junkie.


    Out, damnéd Spot! Bad Doggy!
    Last Edit: 6 years 7 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    6 years 7 months ago #111 by CrazyMinh
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    • https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiykMDb_JvdAhVCMd4KHWRiBygQjRx6BAgBEAU&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fpin%2F252201647867363882%2F&psig=AOvVaw1gtySzoxUM4Z3ESjsa9uQ2&ust=1535965805080754
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    6 years 7 months ago #112 by Erianaiel
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    • From what I understand from the Whisper stories GEO is a technomagic devise. The traces of magic that Whisper, Fey and others noticed after they knew to look for it, where to create the intuitive interface, since it literally established a magical connection between player and game.
    It only succeeded in almost killing Brian because his nanite swarm had counterhacked the interface to create full body and mental immersion. The game may have allowed for it, though the style of reporting mostly suggests the nanite swarm reporting back through a linux interface, not GEO activating features it should not.

    And I am going with the assumption that GEO is some kind of Berserker Probe.

    When that payload goes off, at or around Zulu, the fallout is not going to be pretty.

    (and it would be hilarious, if uncharacteristic, if the message demi-goddess Nacht has sent herself to be opened at Zulu reads: "Sell all GEO stock immediately. Seriously. Within the next ten minutes, Yes really. Nine and a half minutes now. Chop chop".)
    6 years 2 months ago #113 by Malady
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    • Have we talked about what we know of GEO internals from Whisper1.1?

    ----

    In other thoughts, GEO release date hasn't been specified beyond mid-2006.

    Maybe it's Summer Solstice, and left unsaid 'cause that's a magic day.
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    6 years 2 months ago #114 by Kristin Darken
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    • Hmm.. no. first scene of Revelations 'reveals' what you're looking for: Timestamp - Fort Myers, FL - Friday October 13, 2006 ... quote "The current topic of debate was the Good and Evil Online release that had occurred a month ago, a gaming event that was singly responsible for more missed work and lost sleep than any in the history of computer games."

    Anyone who claims to have been playing 'before' starting the Fall semester of school is talking about the 'beta' test. Yes, there was a beta... and it was closed access like most beta testing was back in the early days of MMO's. There were some character resets along the way but the last start point was still more than a month ahead of the public release... and those characters weren't reset. Coincedentally... those players invited for the final non-reset phase of beta were players from previous beta segments who provided the best feedback and bug reports. And by having a wave of players more advanced than starters who understood how the game worked, they were able to be teachers, guides, leaders, and so on... to provide the foundation of the community that evolved on release.

    Obviously, Jack (Fling) was not in beta. Most of AR, however, was.
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