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Question Meanwhile in Castle Groenwald

7 years 9 months ago - 7 years 9 months ago #1 by Yolandria
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  • Looks like some ones storming the castle! Find out how they did in the comments below!

    Mistress of the shelter for lost and redeemable Woobies!
    Last Edit: 7 years 9 months ago by Yolandria. Reason: Spellings hard!
    7 years 9 months ago #2 by Malady
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  • Ah, young love! And Paris!

    That's a very obvious alias...

    Just 'cause the grunts have their memories wiped, doesn't mean that the leaders don't remember everything...

    Family. Is nice! Even if it's an evil family, they have their morals and things that match most everyone else.
    7 years 9 months ago #3 by konzill
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  • Here's hoping that Sookie was more than just a walk on part. Though I guess if eventual defection is in Kessel storyline she could show up again, just to show that he doesn't have the stomach for summary execution.
    7 years 9 months ago #4 by Dreamer
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  • SPOILER ALERT
    Below is a stream of conscious commentary I type up as I read the story. There will details from the story included in it. If you have not read the story yet and don't wish to have details of it spoiled, read no further.

    Is it wrong that in my mind I heard the title read in the voice of the announcer from the Super-Friends in the same tone as "Meanwhile in the Hall of Doom".
    Meanwhile at Castle Groenwald comments
    Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

    Thank You for story comments appreciated and help me know me they are being read and liked. :-) Note: My story comments can't nor are trying to replace reading the stories, simply my way of enjoying them and letting the authors know I enjoy them.
    7 years 9 months ago #5 by Wasamon
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  • Dreamer wrote:
    Is it wrong that in my mind I heard the title read in the voice of the announcer from the Super-Friends in the same tone as "Meanwhile in the Hall of Doom".


    Considering that's about where the title came from... nope, not at all.
    7 years 9 months ago - 7 years 9 months ago #6 by Kettlekorn
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  • In case anybody is wondering, a kesselflicker is a tinker . Google Translate handles that just fine, but if you give it his full name of der kesselflicker, instead of the expected result of the tinker, it spits out a more amusing the kettle flicker. That's what I'm going to call him in my head from now on.

    The bit with the Flag Men was great.

    I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.
    Last Edit: 7 years 9 months ago by Kettlekorn.
    7 years 9 months ago #7 by Katssun
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  • Wow.

    What an about-face for an organization that was last seen in a bumbling retreat, years of planning foiled mostly by two teenage girls and their adoptive parents.

    I mean, just starting off, we saw Lillian and crew blasting off in an emergency shuttle capable of going anywhere in the world from low orbit...and she lands hours away by car from their previous location. That means Castle Groenwald is a less than a day's travel from Bianca or Penny! We knew Lillian was affecting her accent, but I figured she had left her secret childhood behind out of shame. Not so!

    Then the callback to Achziger needing to be patched up by Kessel, who is revealed to be Lillian's son.

    Now she's allied politically with a host of Mammon, picked up a 7th year DeVille, who would have graduated close to the top of her cohort if not for her rival manifesting as a mutant while at the academy, and between another long-lead set of plans, having demonic allies in D.C., and her own induced empathy power, is a shoe-in to take national political office?
    Assuming that's national, since Wikipedia tells me that district is currently obsolete in the real world.

    Erica better start living up to Oma's legacy real quick. Or she'll need a little bit more than her new friends and cousin to pull her well-toned tush out of the flames. Lillian still hopes that Hans and Winifred will rejoin the family. But she did not make any mention of those she considers genefilth or are Jewish...or is that one in the same to her?

    Maybe Erica should consider seducing her enemy's son away from her, just like her dear Oma and auntie. :P
    7 years 9 months ago #8 by Kettlekorn
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  • Katssun wrote: What an about-face for an organization that was last seen in a bumbling retreat, years of planning foiled mostly by two teenage girls and their adoptive parents.

    It didn't seem bumbling to me. Especially since we did know at the time that one of those teenage girls had superpowers, all four of the adoptive parents were secret agents, and on top of that they had the assistance of two superheroes. In fact, Groenwald's organization has always seemed like one of the more competent ones. She isn't just a villain; she's a leader.

    I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.
    7 years 8 months ago - 7 years 8 months ago #9 by Katssun
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  • Kettlekorn wrote:

    Katssun wrote: What an about-face for an organization that was last seen in a bumbling retreat, years of planning foiled mostly by two teenage girls and their adoptive parents.

    It didn't seem bumbling to me. Especially since we did know at the time that one of those teenage girls had superpowers, all four of the adoptive parents were secret agents, and on top of that they had the assistance of two superheroes.


    Having your rented base be easily infiltrated, your half-brothers defeated by an "inferior race" African-American superhero (who is a baseline), getting punched in the nose by a teen who is now the spitting image of your idol of German purity, betrayed by a selected disciple who doesn't submit to brainwashing, and fleeing wounded, abandoning two of your half-brothers, and skittering off to lick your wounds came off as pretty bumbling to me.

    Granted, a lot of that was the fault of Agent "Now Fits in a Bucket!" Baumgartner, and not Lillian herself, but she was overconfident. Hans and Winnie were known quantities, especially the moment they refuse to help, and if they were abducted, Adolf and Margit were sure to follow. She should have known they were coming, and she failed to account for the damage they'd cause in a very short time.

    But I agree that now that she's shown her true competence, the depth of her varied plans, her capacity as a leader is scary indeed.

    Maybe she was just too emotional invested back then, and wasn't looking at all the angles like she normally does.
    Last Edit: 7 years 8 months ago by Katssun.
    7 years 8 months ago - 7 years 8 months ago #10 by mhalpern
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  • Well I know this has a ton of foreshadowing and clues, I will reread it with a fine tooth comb later, first real look we have had of the "evil academy of evil" aka DeVille.

    The Nazi getting a political office does concern me, a little, however it will be glorious when she falls, and her becoming a tool for the power broker, well thats just business as usual, either way the broker will achieve her ends, and if it wasn't Lillian, it would have been someone else she would have added to her collection of political pawns.

    Its beautiful really, Lillian was introduced as a potential big bad for gen 2, and here we see her setting herself up to being a pawn in someone else's game. I see something akin to Long Fang confronting Azula happening with Pelf telling Lillian "Don't flatter yourself, you were never even a player" at least that's the dynamic I see...

    She has leadership qualities, over a group of people who share her ideals and work ethic, she will not do well when dealing with American government employees, contractors and officials, and she will start to fall apart if too much of her bigotry shows.

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    Last Edit: 7 years 8 months ago by mhalpern.
    7 years 8 months ago #11 by Wasamon
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  • Kattsun: Being too invested emotionally was certainly one thing that didn't help her in that situation, but let's look at the rest of your list:

    "bumbling" - I'd object to that adjective, simply because I associate it more with the squid dude in NYC. A bumbling villain's more likely to shoot himself in the foot, literally.

    "easy infiltration" - 1) they weren't expecting so quick a response (unexpected tracking device on otherwise normal kid), 2) they weren't expecting Adolf to get help from the Syndicate, 3) they WERE expecting someone from the Syndicate to come by to fix those lingering electrical issues eventually.

    "beaten by a baseline" - baseline or not, she had access to an ability that the Groenwalds couldn't replicate, and was good at using it.

    "punched in the nose by a teen" - well, she did leave herself open for that one, but those empathic attacks tend to be all-or-nothing.

    "fleeing wounded" - please, please. "strategic retreat" ;) Not much else to do when things have gone south and the Feds are knocking.

    "abandoning two brothers" - of all the people she could have abandoned, those two are the least likely to get caught anyway. She trusted them to know what to do in a situation, and that trust was warranted.

    Also, to mhalpern: consider what her actual abilities are. Charismatic empathy, training in oratory and rhetoric, and a calculating mind. Now consider the ramifications if she's caught after some time in office.
    7 years 8 months ago #12 by Domoviye
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  • Damn good story.
    The villains are competent, flawed, have their own quarks and interests without being cartoony or cliched, and when on the job they're freaking scary. Very human, which can be hard to find in fiction.
    I hope we see more of Sookie, she seems like she's got some good potential.
    Also poor Greasy, having his invention replicated by an antimutant organization that will easily outmarket him. I hope that's not his main source of income.
    7 years 8 months ago #13 by mhalpern
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  • Wasamon wrote: Also, to mhalpern: consider what her actual abilities are. Charismatic empathy, training in oratory and rhetoric, and a calculating mind. Now consider the ramifications if she's caught after some time in office.


    The ramifications are "what do you know, another corrupt politician" the sticky part is what she does when IN office, if she can manage much, as she is going to be dealing with people who don't share her ideals, and she can't use any form of physical threat on without getting sued to next century. She is great at making things go to plan, but she fails at improvisation it seems. Now while that is great for small scale, she is trying to expand, and without the ability to improvise well, she will over reach and fail. For instance, copying Greasy's invention is okay in theory, until you factor in that the patent is probably being protected by either AJG or Sidewinder Holdings or both, some very powerful legal clout, whom can probably prove that the copy has enough key similarities to be a clear derivative, and they are operating under the assumption that it is a poorly protected patent. When that plan backfires, it will disparage her entire campaign message about going against corrupt politicians. Patent law is one of those things that few Americans are ok with being violated, more so than other IP protections, because to many it is part of the American dream, and how many have achieved it, (recent example is Elon Musk) so a politician being found to endorse the violation of Patent Law, it could easy outrage many people.

    She is making intricate plans, and executing most of them near perfectly, but because they are so intricate, one of them screwing up can blow back on the others in a BIG way. KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) applies to more than just engineering.

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 8 months ago - 7 years 8 months ago #14 by Katssun
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  • Wasamon wrote: Kattsun: Being too invested emotionally was certainly one thing that didn't help her in that situation, but let's look at the rest of your list:
    [SNIP]

    Duly noted, and thanks for responding. If my first post wasn't clear, this story far exceeded my expectations from when I began reading it. Even if I misinterpreted your intention in Eisenmadel 1, pt. 1, loud and clear here. Lillian went from a theme-villain in my eyes, even as she explicitly denounced the prominent Nazi theme villains as boorish do-nothings accomplish-nothings making more noise than progress, to a very credible threat.

    She may be buying into something nasty in exchange for reaching the next height, but she runs a very thorough organization, that is better hidden than I could have ever imagined.

    She inspires loyalty. She supports those who rely on her. She cares deeply for her "family" even if she doesn't consider certain others worthy.

    Lillian is shown to be a very charismatic leader, who feels very human at the same time. She's even likable, but not without fault, and that is especially important.

    She's real, even if I find her beliefs repellent. I want to read more about her, and how she clashes with Erica in the future, since she considers Gina the true heir. Or even if she and Erica never meet face to face again, I want to read more about Lillian and her efforts.

    edit:
    As for Lillian's political future, she's shown to be subtle. Mammon might get the best of her if she's too greedy and goes too far too fast, but she has been shown to be a long-term planner.

    She doesn't even have to be overt about her ideals. Look at what happened to Erica while she was still in Kansas. The entire state declared mutants illegal. Lillian can gently push toward the same goal, supporting those governors who think similarly. She may not have to promote the Aryan ideal itself, but she can push to make the American Heartland "pure" of mutant kind, simply be promoting an agenda that makes them unwanted and move away to more friendly areas.

    Introduce bills to cut support to the DPA, while increasing the budget, scope, and authority of the MCO, promote "family first" kinds of agendas, and so on.

    That's what makes her really terrifying in the political realm. She's a planner.
    Last Edit: 7 years 8 months ago by Katssun.
    7 years 8 months ago #15 by Sir Lee
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  • I wonder. Yes, she's charismatic, but at the end of the day she is just one U.S. representative -- a newbie one at that -- among hundreds. Her influence will be limited until/unless she manages to form a sizeable voting block under her guidance. It's not like the real power brokers will be willing to let her set the legislative agenda. And politicking in Congress takes considerable time from one's schedule. I wonder if her plans wouldn't have been better served by placing a minion in that role. If she's aiming for the White House, well, it takes time.
    Although, thinking of it, there's a possible shortcut, one that would be very convenient to her operations in the meantime: leverage the Congress seat into the Iowa governor's mansion. That would giver her considerable local power and a better platform to aim for the White House.

    It was... interesting to see the family interacting as, well, family. In particular, Lillian may be overlooking the fact that her son is first and foremost a teen. And teenagers are very likely to do things that their parents disapprove of. Bluntly speaking, his priorities are not her priorities. His priorities are dating Elektra, hanging with his friends and fiddling with "cool stuff." Ruthlessly killing people just because you don't like their genetic makeup is so down the list that on the first chance he got, he disobeyed his elders.

    Also... I couldn't believe that Sandmann is a Blues Brothers fan. Especially considering that Jake and Elwood humiliate and ridicule Illinois Nazis without even trying hard. Glas probably didn't even get the joke.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 8 months ago #16 by Katssun
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  • But in one-on-one meetings, isn't Lillian particularly "persuasive?"

    She may be able to get farther with her agenda without even introducing any bills herself. Or maybe she'll easily find cosponsors.
    7 years 8 months ago #17 by mhalpern
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  • Sir Lee wrote: I wonder. Yes, she's charismatic, but at the end of the day she is just one U.S. representative -- a newbie one at that -- among hundreds. Her influence will be limited until/unless she manages to form a sizeable voting block under her guidance. It's not like the real power brokers will be willing to let her set the legislative agenda. And politicking in Congress takes considerable time from one's schedule. I wonder if her plans wouldn't have been better served by placing a minion in that role. If she's aiming for the White House, well, it takes time.
    Although, thinking of it, there's a possible shortcut, one that would be very convenient to her operations in the meantime: leverage the Congress seat into the Iowa governor's mansion. That would giver her considerable local power and a better platform to aim for the White House.

    It was... interesting to see the family interacting as, well, family. In particular, Lillian may be overlooking the fact that her son is first and foremost a teen. And teenagers are very likely to do things that their parents disapprove of. Bluntly speaking, his priorities are not her priorities. His priorities are dating Elektra, hanging with his friends and fiddling with "cool stuff." Ruthlessly killing people just because you don't like their genetic makeup is so down the list that on the first chance he got, he disobeyed his elders.

    Also... I couldn't believe that Sandmann is a Blues Brothers fan. Especially considering that Jake and Elwood humiliate and ridicule Illinois Nazis without even trying hard. Glas probably didn't even get the joke.


    Of course there is the possibility that her son is a gadgeteer, and is hiding it

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    7 years 8 months ago #18 by mhalpern
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  • Katssun wrote:

    Wasamon wrote: Kattsun: Being too invested emotionally was certainly one thing that didn't help her in that situation, but let's look at the rest of your list:
    [SNIP]

    Duly noted, and thanks for responding. If my first post wasn't clear, this story far exceeded my expectations from when I began reading it. Even if I misinterpreted your intention in Eisenmadel 1, pt. 1, loud and clear here. Lillian went from a theme-villain in my eyes, even as she explicitly denounced the prominent Nazi theme villains as boorish do-nothings accomplish-nothings making more noise than progress, to a very credible threat.

    She may be buying into something nasty in exchange for reaching the next height, but she runs a very thorough organization, that is better hidden than I could have ever imagined.

    She inspires loyalty. She supports those who rely on her. She cares deeply for her "family" even if she doesn't consider certain others worthy.

    Lillian is shown to be a very charismatic leader, who feels very human at the same time. She's even likable, but not without fault, and that is especially important.

    She's real, even if I find her beliefs repellent. I want to read more about her, and how she clashes with Erica in the future, since she considers Gina the true heir. Or even if she and Erica never meet face to face again, I want to read more about Lillian and her efforts.

    edit:
    As for Lillian's political future, she's shown to be subtle. Mammon might get the best of her if she's too greedy and goes too far too fast, but she has been shown to be a long-term planner.

    She doesn't even have to be overt about her ideals. Look at what happened to Erica while she was still in Kansas. The entire state declared mutants illegal. Lillian can gently push toward the same goal, supporting those governors who think similarly. She may not have to promote the Aryan ideal itself, but she can push to make the American Heartland "pure" of mutant kind, simply be promoting an agenda that makes them unwanted and move away to more friendly areas.

    Introduce bills to cut support to the DPA, while increasing the budget, scope, and authority of the MCO, promote "family first" kinds of agendas, and so on.

    That's what makes her really terrifying in the political realm. She's a planner.

    In a primarily agricultural state? Not that much of an impact

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 8 months ago #19 by Malady
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  • mhalpern wrote:

    Sir Lee wrote: It was... interesting to see the family interacting as, well, family. In particular, Lillian may be overlooking the fact that her son is first and foremost a teen. And teenagers are very likely to do things that their parents disapprove of. Bluntly speaking, his priorities are not her priorities. His priorities are dating Elektra, hanging with his friends and fiddling with "cool stuff." Ruthlessly killing people just because you don't like their genetic makeup is so down the list that on the first chance he got, he disobeyed his elders.


    Of course there is the possibility that her son is a gadgeteer, and is hiding it


    Unlikely 'cause she's probably doing genescan protocols like the Goodkinds did.

    WMG: Nimbus or someone like him is messing with her family, 'cause the Greenwoods are the / a Goodkind-replacement of G2...

    :facepalm:... Just use the Vanguard (Did I get that right?) as your Nimbus-replacement for that idea.
    7 years 8 months ago #20 by Dreamer
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  • It was stated in story Kessel was subjected to the treatments and then serum as his mother, which gave him enhanced physical and mental abilities, improved immune system, and one 1 psionic ability without having an active metagene complex. Gadgeteer is a psionic aka psychic ability, listed under ESP with its own separate entry. All the Groenwalds we have seen so far with powers have been subjected to this same thing.

    Thank You for story comments appreciated and help me know me they are being read and liked. :-) Note: My story comments can't nor are trying to replace reading the stories, simply my way of enjoying them and letting the authors know I enjoy them.
    7 years 8 months ago #21 by Malady
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  • Dreamer wrote: It was stated in story Kessel was subjected to the treatments and then serum as his mother, which gave him enhanced physical and mental abilities, improved immune system, and one 1 psionic ability without having an active metagene complex. Gadgeteer is a psionic aka psychic ability, listed under ESP with its own separate entry. All the Groenwalds we have seen so far with powers have been subjected to this same thing.


    But, Gadgeteerism is different from general ESP... Although, nothing says that mutation is the only way to get typical mutant powers.

    Eisenmadel might actually be totally a regular Exemplar, except for lacking a metagene... Or having a totally different metagene.

    I've been thinking that Lillian might have some of the Exemplar Syndromes, and is basically an EX like Eisenmadel is...
    7 years 8 months ago #22 by Katssun
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  • Lillian said in the first story that the Groenwald experiments have specific genetic tags that the enhancement protocol requires be there for the rest of the procedure to work, and those only exist at conception. Without them, the enhancement (powers, health, strength, reflexes, reduced ageing, etc.) doesn't work.

    That's what she said Hans' breakthrough was. He enhanced Danielle first with a serum that required no genetic tags as receptors or whatever, which repaired her damaged DNA and saved her life. Hans' serum added the tags that the enhancement protocol uses, which Lillian then used on Danielle when she found her and renamed her Miene.

    Lillian was also given the enhancement, because she stated that she was stuck living with her grandmother when her father found her and made her powerful and beautiful. Very Tansy, but without the mutation. But, she doesn't say how old she was at the time. Presumably far younger than when she later used it on Erica's mother.
    7 years 8 months ago #23 by Malady
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  • OH! ... What else do we know about those markers?? Nothing else, I guess... But what does Lillian and her group know? Might she be testing for parts of the metagene complex and not know it?
    7 years 8 months ago #24 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • So... Lillian Groenwald (who's last name roughly means "Green Forest") has cleverly disguised herself as an ordinary human being named Lily Greenwood, and thrust herself into the national spotlight without making any effort to disguise her appearance. It's a good thing that there are no secret agents looking for her...

    George makes me think of Derek Black . There's hope for him, I think, but only if he is given some good influences. A honeypot won't work though, as he already has a girlfriend.

    I'm far less optimistic about the niece's chances of escaping. She's spent over half a decade at a school for criminals. If she has moral fiber to have retained any amount of a conscience through that, she'll probably be drawn in by the loving-kindness of the Groenwalds.

    "Shared pain is lessened; shared joy, increased — thus do we refute entropy." - Spider Robinson
    7 years 8 months ago #25 by Sir Lee
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  • OTOH, she was trained from a young age to be distrustful and cynical, looking always for Number One. The chances of her drinking the Kool-Aid and becoming a sincere militant white supremacist are quite low. She would betray her new family in a Planck time unit if she saw an upside for her.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 8 months ago #26 by Malady
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  • Sir Lee wrote: OTOH, she was trained from a young age to be distrustful and cynical, looking always for Number One. The chances of her drinking the Kool-Aid and becoming a sincere militant white supremacist are quite low. She would betray her new family in a Planck time unit if she saw an upside for her.


    So, who's available to offer what upsides? I'm guessing she'll staying around for the upgrades that I think they're planning to give to her?
    7 years 8 months ago #27 by Katssun
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  • Sir Lee wrote: OTOH, she was trained from a young age to be distrustful and cynical, looking always for Number One. The chances of her drinking the Kool-Aid and becoming a sincere militant white supremacist are quite low. She would betray her new family in a Planck time unit if she saw an upside for her.


    I'm not so sure. She's a DeVille, who quickly puts the fear into their charges, all abandoned, all orphans.

    But the really screwed up part of Lillian's character is that if you qualify as part of her family, she actually really cares for you. She's even loving. It shows in the way she treats Miene, despite her coming from a part of the family that betrayed the cause.

    Angelique may be distrustful, cynical, and ambitious, but she hasn't experienced being treated like actual family and part of a trusted inner circle. That can be a very powerful force, especially when it is bolstered by someone with Lillian's powers.
    7 years 8 months ago #28 by mhalpern
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  • Malady wrote:

    Sir Lee wrote: OTOH, she was trained from a young age to be distrustful and cynical, looking always for Number One. The chances of her drinking the Kool-Aid and becoming a sincere militant white supremacist are quite low. She would betray her new family in a Planck time unit if she saw an upside for her.


    So, who's available to offer what upsides? I'm guessing she'll staying around for the upgrades that I think they're planning to give to her?

    Only one upside is needed, the upside of not getting caught when everything starts to collapse. She sees her Aunt's plans falling apart, and she will grab everything she can and git, possibly (probably) sabotaging the escape of the rest of the family, so that she doesn't have anyone hunting her. Simple, ruthless and effective.

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 8 months ago #29 by Katssun
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  • Rampant speculation here, but who is Angelique intended to be the nemesis of, Erica, or Penny?
    7 years 8 months ago #30 by mhalpern
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  • Katssun wrote:

    Sir Lee wrote: OTOH, she was trained from a young age to be distrustful and cynical, looking always for Number One. The chances of her drinking the Kool-Aid and becoming a sincere militant white supremacist are quite low. She would betray her new family in a Planck time unit if she saw an upside for her.


    I'm not so sure. She's a DeVille, who quickly puts the fear into their charges, all abandoned, all orphans.

    But the really screwed up part of Lillian's character is that if you qualify as part of her family, she actually really cares for you. She's even loving. It shows in the way she treats Miene, despite her coming from a part of the family that betrayed the cause.

    Angelique may be distrustful, cynical, and ambitious, but she hasn't experienced being treated like actual family and part of a trusted inner circle. That can be a very powerful force, especially when it is bolstered by someone with Lillian's powers.

    It can be a powerful force, unless she is so far gone she doesn't WANT it, in any case, even if she does learn to trust them, it is unlikely she will be loyal, when push comes to shove, THEY wont be worth risking HER life for.

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    7 years 8 months ago - 7 years 8 months ago #31 by Schol-R-LEA
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  • Malady wrote: Or having a totally different metagene.


    This possibility occurred to me as well. We know that there is at least one form of the MMGC that is significantly different from the most common form - namely, the Bloodline variant. It would be a delicious irony if the Groenwalds actually were mutants all along, going back to the Green Skull, but with a form of the MMGC that their own tests don't recognize - one which their treatment can activate, but which cannot be replicated in others in part because it is, in fact, actually a chemo-devise.

    I doubt that this is the case, but it is worth mentioning.

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    Last Edit: 7 years 8 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    7 years 8 months ago #32 by mhalpern
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  • Schol-R-LEA wrote:

    Malady wrote: Or having a totally different metagene.


    This possibility occurred to me as well. We know that there is at least one form of the MMGC that is significantly different from the most common form - namely, the Bloodline variant. It would be a delicious irony if the Groenwalds actually were mutants all along, going back to the Green Skull, but with a form of the MMGC that their own tests don't recognize - one which their treatment can activate, but which cannot be replicated in others in part because it is, in fact, actually a chemo-devise.

    I doubt that this is the case, but it is worth mentioning.


    Actually that could explain Erica, quite well...

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 8 months ago #33 by Iwasforger03
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  • mhalpern wrote:

    Schol-R-LEA wrote:

    Malady wrote: Or having a totally different metagene.


    This possibility occurred to me as well. We know that there is at least one form of the MMGC that is significantly different from the most common form - namely, the Bloodline variant. It would be a delicious irony if the Groenwalds actually were mutants all along, going back to the Green Skull, but with a form of the MMGC that their own tests don't recognize - one which their treatment can activate, but which cannot be replicated in others in part because it is, in fact, actually a chemo-devise.

    I doubt that this is the case, but it is worth mentioning.


    Actually that could explain Erica, quite well...


    I agree. that would absolutely be the most delicious of ironies... but supposedly they think all the kids in Kessel's friend group might compatible, and whatever the formula was that Erica took, the first attempt at replicating it did seem to induce SOME kind of powers in Cousin Penny.

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    7 years 8 months ago #34 by mhalpern
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  • Iwasforger03 wrote:

    mhalpern wrote:

    Schol-R-LEA wrote:

    Malady wrote: Or having a totally different metagene.


    This possibility occurred to me as well. We know that there is at least one form of the MMGC that is significantly different from the most common form - namely, the Bloodline variant. It would be a delicious irony if the Groenwalds actually were mutants all along, going back to the Green Skull, but with a form of the MMGC that their own tests don't recognize - one which their treatment can activate, but which cannot be replicated in others in part because it is, in fact, actually a chemo-devise.

    I doubt that this is the case, but it is worth mentioning.


    Actually that could explain Erica, quite well...


    I agree. that would absolutely be the most delicious of ironies... but supposedly they think all the kids in Kessel's friend group might compatible, and whatever the formula was that Erica took, the first attempt at replicating it did seem to induce SOME kind of powers in Cousin Penny.


    it is established that the MCO sequencers are Yes/No machines, presumably most screening just searches for the common gene complexes and if they are active, we know that the common MMGC often has a stress trigger activation, it could be this MMGC needs a chemical key (the prep serum) and Eric's stress did the rest.

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 8 months ago #35 by Malady
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  • ... I forget, Sympathetic Blood Link Magic or whatever can't find the missing Abendritter? Or the Gorenwalds?
    7 years 8 months ago #36 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • Malady wrote: ... I forget, Sympathetic Blood Link Magic or whatever can't find the missing Abendritter? Or the Gorenwalds?

    Maybe it could. But none of these characters are really connected to the WU magical community (If anything, being so firmly in the "mad science" community probably prejudices them against it). They'd have to think of the idea, and then find someone who could perform the spells for them, and then they'll probably get all sorts of false positives and other weird results, especially considering the unnatural things that have been done to their bloodline.

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    7 years 8 months ago #37 by Wasamon
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  • OK, random responses to stuff:

    Blues Brothers was a particularly popular movie for a pair of mismatched almost-twins from southern Illinois back in the day. There's a level of cognitive dissonance when it comes to the Illinois Nazis and themselves, partly because no one likes to identify with the baddies too much and partly because the Groenwalds as a whole don't mentally group themselves with the standard American Fascist Party or white nationalists (i.e. "posers"). Sure, they share a lot of the basic politics and mindset, but they also consider themselves a step above "Those Wacky Nazis" and the like.

    Basically, in-canon Glas and Sandmann just don't see themselves in the Illinois Nazis. Out-of-canon, I needed a good model for their personalities, speech patterns, and interaction when it became apparent that they were going to be more than bit villains, and a dash of Jake and Elwood worked quite well.

    As for the way the power enhancements work... I'm still working on this, but Opa's full explanation will likely include epigenetic marker tags, homeotic boxes and vestigial trait appearance, and the ubermensch theory of Ultima Thule in Nazi myth.

    Finally, Kessel is for all intents and purposes a gadgeteer. He has an intuitive ESP trait that allows him to quickly discern the function, use, and potential of technology, which he can then repair, upgrade, combine, or reverse engineer as needed. On the other hand, his ability to innovate is still limited by experience, and he's not that good at making completely new stuff. Almost all the items he produces for the family are derivative of something else, if adapted and altered to enough of an extent that under patent law they can be considered different enough to count as an alternate means to achieve the same end.
    7 years 8 months ago #38 by Katssun
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  • Now you're making me wonder if Kessel will be tasked to infiltrate Whateley a few months down the line.

    I don't know if I missed it, but how old is George supposed to be?
    7 years 8 months ago #39 by Valentine
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  • Wasamon wrote: OK, random responses to stuff:

    Blues Brothers was a particularly popular movie for a pair of mismatched almost-twins from southern Illinois back in the day. There's a level of cognitive dissonance when it comes to the Illinois Nazis and themselves, partly because no one likes to identify with the baddies too much and partly because the Groenwalds as a whole don't mentally group themselves with the standard American Fascist Party or white nationalists (i.e. "posers"). Sure, they share a lot of the basic politics and mindset, but they also consider themselves a step above "Those Wacky Nazis" and the like.

    Basically, in-canon Glas and Sandmann just don't see themselves in the Illinois Nazis. Out-of-canon, I needed a good model for their personalities, speech patterns, and interaction when it became apparent that they were going to be more than bit villains, and a dash of Jake and Elwood worked quite well.

    As for the way the power enhancements work... I'm still working on this, but Opa's full explanation will likely include epigenetic marker tags, homeotic boxes and vestigial trait appearance, and the ubermensch theory of Ultima Thule in Nazi myth.

    Finally, Kessel is for all intents and purposes a gadgeteer. He has an intuitive ESP trait that allows him to quickly discern the function, use, and potential of technology, which he can then repair, upgrade, combine, or reverse engineer as needed. On the other hand, his ability to innovate is still limited by experience, and he's not that good at making completely new stuff. Almost all the items he produces for the family are derivative of something else, if adapted and altered to enough of an extent that under patent law they can be considered different enough to count as an alternate means to achieve the same end.


    Southern Illinois????

    Even Chicagoans don't count Joliet as Southern Illinois. They count it as the SouthWest corner of Northern Illinois. (Elwood is kind of the new corner there, of Northern Illinois, as it has the furthest SW part of the Chicago RTA currently.)

    Sorry a bit of a pet peeve of mine. I grew up in Joliet, and my parents currently live in Elwood.

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    7 years 7 months ago #40 by Wasamon
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  • Glas and Sandmann (a.k.a. Rick and Rob) are from southern Illinois :P

    The fact that Jake and Elwood were from farther north, and not anything like local kids, only made them cooler to emulate.
    7 years 7 months ago - 7 years 7 months ago #41 by Schol-R-LEA
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  • I always had the impression that he was called Joliet Jake because of all the time he spent there - involuntarily. I haven't seen the movie in a long time, though, nor am I really familiar with the other Blues Brothers stuff not from the original film.

    (And yes, I know that there's more to the town than just the prison, but that is what most people outside of the area think of when they hear the name 'Joliet' in a context other than CD-R formats.)

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    Last Edit: 7 years 7 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    7 years 7 months ago #42 by Valentine
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  • Schol-R-LEA wrote: I always had the impression that he was called Joliet Jake because of all the time he spent there - involuntarily. I haven't seen the movie in a long time, though, nor am I really familiar with the other Blues Brothers stuff not from the original film.

    (And yes, I know that there's more to the town than just the prison, but that is what most people outside of the area think of when they hear the name 'Joliet' in a context other than CD-R formats.)


    Being from Joliet originally, I can tell you that the city does have other things besides that Prison. There is the County Jail, the City Jail, a Juvenile Prison, and Stateville Prison. :P (OK Stateville is just outside city limits, but they claim it anyway.)

    Joliet also has one of the prettiest high schools I have ever seen.



    It has everything a city of its size would be expected to have and a river with concrete sides.


    (I was very confused why other rivers didn't have concrete sides as a little kid.)

    And a quaint little theatre I watched movies in as a little kid.



    I went and saw the Flying karamazov Brothers much later, and ran into them after the show "oohing and aahing" over the lobby.

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    7 years 7 months ago - 7 years 7 months ago #43 by DanZilla
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  • Schol-R-LEA wrote: I always had the impression that he was called Joliet Jake because of all the time he spent there - involuntarily. I haven't seen the movie in a long time, though, nor am I really familiar with the other Blues Brothers stuff not from the original film.


    Heh... far as I recall, not having watched the movie in a good time myself... They visit the "Penguin" in the orphanage they were raised at in Chicago... still further North than Southern Illinois but not Joliet... and, yeah, his nickname was from the prison time as far as I can recall.
    Last Edit: 7 years 7 months ago by DanZilla.
    7 years 7 months ago #44 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • Valentine wrote: Joliet also has one of the prettiest high schools I have ever seen.

    <snip>

    It looks like a castle!

    (I was very confused why other rivers didn't have concrete sides as a little kid.)

    The LA river has concrete sides! It's just missing the water.

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