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Question Rescuing Sara Waite

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5 years 7 months ago #1 by rcaffin

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Is no-one going to rescue Sara? To be sure, she is bound in a circle, but I can think of ways around that. Whateley needs her back!

Cheers

5 years 7 months ago #2 by Anne

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rcaffin wrote: Is no-one going to rescue Sara? To be sure, she is bound in a circle, but I can think of ways around that. Whateley needs her back!

Cheers

Several OOC methods have been discussed in the microscene thread. However until she starts complaining to her author that she has spent far too much time bound on Tyvek we probably will see no more of Sara.
The sad thing is that when a character has been in hiatus as long as Sara it is easier to leave them in limbo than to reintegrate them with the new reality. One part of which is that Team Kimba is doing their best to lay low (mostly due to their author being further in hiatus than Sara's) and there has been a new order initiated by Wyatt... Among other problems. If you look closely in the micro-scene thread you may see some of the ideas I've had about what might have happened to Speakeasy...

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5 years 7 months ago #3 by Sir Lee

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Actually, the way Sara has been taken out of the scene might make it easier to reintegrate her back.
I mean, if, say, Renae showed up tomorrow and wanted to pick up Paige and Petra, she would have to figure out what they have been doing for the last ten months or so, in a way that's not incompatible with whatever mentions the other authors have made to the characters (not many, but there are a few), and (likely) fast forward through it. A little bit like J.G. had to do with the Outcasts and Murphy.
OTOH, If Bender wants to bring Sara back, she can jump right into the present day, no filler needed (well, some filler for the December through... April? period where she was still in campus. But that's a fixed amount, not growing every day). A mostly off-camera "welcome back" where she is told everything that happened while she was away, and she's good to go.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

5 years 7 months ago #4 by rcaffin

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OK, I am a newbie to the Forum, but I have just about every storied issued saved on file. Really fun stuff!

Are you telling me that no-one intends to handle anything about the battle with The Bastard? The whole scene is to be abandoned? APPALLING! What a lost opportunity for total mayhem!

To be sure, someone locked in a circle cannot be detected by magic - or so the story goes. BUT when this happens, there has to be a bit of a Null Hole left in the immediate vicinity of the bit of paper. The Laws of Magic do not permit perfect concealment: there are always defects.
Equally, it should not be impossible to detect Sara using a non-magical means. For instance, I am sure both Paige & Petra are missing her: is their link with Sara annulled by the circle? Muffled perhaps, but not totally blocked.
Then there is Gypsy, who is also linked to Sara. A good Q is whether the Tarot cards belong entirely within the realm of magic - one could argue that they do not. At the least, they could provide some guidance.
Chou is linked to the Tao, and I doubt the Tao is keen on losing such a major player in the balance. Can the Tapestry can provide any clues via Chou?
Finally, Jade - also linked very mysteriously to another Demon. Can the mistress of Chaos do anything? Heh heh - surely!

Cheers

5 years 7 months ago #5 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: Are you telling me that no-one intends to handle anything about the battle with The Bastard? The whole scene is to be abandoned? APPALLING! What a lost opportunity for total mayhem!

Not no one, but rather some ones who aren't necessarily in Team Kimba. The Bastard is the intended target of the Atlantean League, after all. There's also a mention in one of the between-years stories in which Kodiak thinks he's done with The Bastard. One hopes he wasn't interred at HPARC.

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5 years 7 months ago #6 by Sir Lee

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Oh, sure there are plans for the Bastard. The Atlantean League was formed for that express purpose.

But, on a meta level, without an author some characters become a problem for the setting -- because they are very powerful, it easily becomes an issue of "why won't they ask such-and-such for help?" So, they had to be taken from center stage in some way. Fey was nerfed, Sara was put on a bus (check TVtropes for the reference, and come back when you can dig yourself out of that time sink in, oh... a month or two). Heyoka was killed off, although not really because they was too powerful, but because their role had become somewhat redundant with the introduction of Kayda. Ayla and Tennyo are still a bit of a hindrance to the writers, but they are easier to work around, so they are just "keeping quiet" with the rest of Team Kimba.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

5 years 7 months ago #7 by rcaffin

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Not wishing to be hugely argumentative, but not convinced and not happy.

Yes, the Atlantean League is meant to have the Bastard as a target, but frankly I do not trust The Committee (or Hardass for that matter). The secrecy surrounding the League and how it is being kept from TK is, to my mind, a worry. Regardless, why kill off TK? Why indeed!

Sara was commissioned by Carson to find the malign influence within Whateley, and there have been a few veiled references to him. It does not seem that anyone is bothering about this any more. And that despite the obvious potential for disaster from this character.

Then there are the 1000 weres reaching the Reservation just as they are needed to deal with the Voodoo Wolves. What about them?

It just seems to me that there are so many loose ends which could be turned into wonderful stories - before that huge time jump is made. So many opportunities just going to waste. So many opportunities for - well, mayhem!

Cheers
PS: do I have to deal with a captcha with every posting still?

5 years 7 months ago #8 by Rose Bunny

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During the Whateley-con Discord fun Dr. Bender popped in and says she has plans for Sara and some of her pack, like Jet, for instance. As far as the rest of Kimba, Hank really is the only one with an author around. The others pop up in his escapades. When it comes to why Nikki and the others are excluded from the League, reasons have been given. The Reverend stated that he wanted Nikki left out of it. Chao was thought to be too big a wildcard, Billie is the nuclear option to everything, including jaywalking. Too much potential for global catastrophic damage.

There have been valid reasons given in most cases as to why write-arounds were done on Kimba... The Necromancer and Hekate have gotten their asses handed to them by Fae, so their on campus plans are to avoid her.

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5 years 7 months ago #9 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: Sara was commissioned by Carson to find the malign influence within Whateley, and there have been a few veiled references to him. It does not seem that anyone is bothering about this any more. And that despite the obvious potential for disaster from this character.

Other than Grimes, Kayda, Carson, Totem, The Don, Tansy, and Circe, you're right.

Sara has her suspicions (which may have been confirmed), as does Bluejay. Knowing as much about the Kellith as HM does, it's been a slow-paced cat-and-mouse game between them.

rcaffin wrote: It just seems to me that there are so many loose ends which could be turned into wonderful stories - before that huge time jump is made. So many opportunities just going to waste. So many opportunities for - well, mayhem!

TK doesn't even graduate until 2010. Team Absinthe has another year after that. Team Awesome comes close to being around when the Mutant Mayhem Machine around. The world doesn't end with Kayda "I'm by no means a mere freshman!" Franks' graduation.

They haven't even gotten around to breaking ground on the <some person with influential parents> memorial confidence course used by the Flying Club for a number of years.

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5 years 7 months ago #10 by Valentine

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rcaffin wrote: Is no-one going to rescue Sara? To be sure, she is bound in a circle, but I can think of ways around that. Whateley needs her back!

Cheers

There have been several scenes dealing with the search for Sara. I'm sure that Jet is spending all her spare time looking for her, Hippy too, and the rest of her Pack. Jade probably does too.

The problem is the scale of the search area. The school covers several square miles of area, and is filled with a near unmappable warren of tunnels and rooms.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 7 months ago #11 by rcaffin

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Obviously I am completely ignorant of all the background stuff which has been ever so briefly mentioned here - which is great because that means I can be utterly uninhibited about trying to stir the system back into action.

But how can I do this? I very much doubt that I have the amazing creativity Gen I authors have displayed, although I make a very passable Editor (in several places over the last 20 years).

Hippy now has Erin. She may not be as motivated imho. Does Jet exist any more - except perhaps as a shade? (Novel concept - Jet as a shade!)

The scale of the search area is huge - unless we narrow it down! This can be done!

Cheers

5 years 7 months ago #12 by Valentine

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rcaffin wrote: Obviously I am completely ignorant of all the background stuff which has been ever so briefly mentioned here - which is great because that means I can be utterly uninhibited about trying to stir the system back into action.

But how can I do this? I very much doubt that I have the amazing creativity Gen I authors have displayed, although I make a very passable Editor (in several places over the last 20 years).

Hippy now has Erin. She may not be as motivated imho. Does Jet exist any more - except perhaps as a shade? (Novel concept - Jet as a shade!)

The scale of the search area is huge - unless we narrow it down! This can be done!

Cheers

Since I don't know what you've read, Hippy was the one that brought the missing Sara to Admin's attention. Jet, from my understanding, needs a sexual encounter to recharge, something any of Sara's Pack can provide. All of Sara's Pack have her mark, they are linked to her, not as tightly as Jade to Billie, but enough that they need her to be found.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 7 months ago #13 by Sir Lee

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rcaffin, you appear to be under the impression that TK has been set aside due to lack of interest in writing stories about them. It's not that; it's rather that Gen1 was set up rather informally, with the understanding that each author had exclusive rights to direct their character's evolution. The informal understanding was that other authors may only use them as supporting characters, and even so consulting the character "owner" if possible. Nobody planned for authors leaving or otherwise becoming unavailable, which in hindsight was a mistake (and I understand was addressed in the setting up of Gen2).

If for the sake of argument the current Cabal decided to, say, give Jade to a new author, that would be a massive breach of trust. If then Babs showed up, she would be well within her rights to be very pissed. Or perhaps even one of the other "silent" authors, even if not directly involved, could become angry at the perceived betrayal of a fellow author. And having a fight between the canon authors would be a MUCH more serious problem than characters being sidelined.

Other than the original authors (the ones who are reachable, anyway) officially "handing over" the characters to a new author, there simply isn't a way to take over those characters. It's not an ideal situation, but it's what it is.

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5 years 7 months ago #14 by elrodw

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Sir Lee wrote: rcaffin, you appear to be under the impression that TK has been set aside due to lack of interest in writing stories about them. It's not that; it's rather that Gen1 was set up rather informally, with the understanding that each author had exclusive rights to direct their character's evolution. The informal understanding was that other authors may only use them as supporting characters, and even so consulting the character "owner" if possible. Nobody planned for authors leaving or otherwise becoming unavailable, which in hindsight was a mistake (and I understand was addressed in the setting up of Gen2).

I wrote one (and only one) Ayla story, but that was with permission from Diane (before she vanished completely). More Ayla from me? Unlikely as a principle character, but as Ayla is currently interested in Charge, who is one of my characters, there may be more appearances of Ayla, but supporting.

Gen 2 got permissions of all the authors that the characters could be 'passed on' to another if an author vanishes or simply quits.

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5 years 7 months ago #15 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: Hippy now has Erin. She may not be as motivated imho. Does Jet exist any more - except perhaps as a shade? (Novel concept - Jet as a shade!)

I think I missed the story where Hippolyta and Feral became an item.

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5 years 7 months ago #16 by rcaffin

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> the story where Hippolyta and Feral became an item
Sara was in the Crystal Palace (I think) and Hippy rather awkwardly explains that she and Erin are, well... Sara was amused, although slightly disappointed that they felt they had to hide it. I think Title - not sure.

> Jet, from my understanding, needs a sexual encounter to recharge
I missed that one! Jet gave her life force (?) to Sara after Sara was ambushed, leaving a heap of fabric behind, and I thought that was it. Details please?

Anyhow, back to rescuing Sara. What we need seems to be an 'unowned' character to be the lead for the story. I doubt that the informal agreements preclude other owned characters from appearing in the story in supporting roles. So who owns Gypsy, or Winnie, or even Carson?

Cheers

5 years 7 months ago #17 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: Anyhow, back to rescuing Sara. What we need seems to be an 'unowned' character to be the lead for the story. I doubt that the informal agreements preclude other owned characters from appearing in the story in supporting roles.

Who is this "we" that you speak of, and what is the need?

I know I'd rather wait to see what Dr. Bender cooks up, because otherwise I don't see what adding Carmilla back into the canon storyline achieves unless someone who understands the character is writing for her.

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5 years 7 months ago #18 by JG

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It's a courtesy thing.

My vision is not Bender's vision is not Elrod's vision is not Bek's vision is not...

You get the idea.

Now there are a few people who I've basically given carte blanche with certain characters, because they've shown they'll stay true to the character as-written.

I won't say which ones, but There's a few.

But the others aren't here to GIVE that carte blanche to the rest of us. They aren't here to say "Joe (or Elrod, or morpheus, or EE, etc) you have a rock-solid handle on the stories i want to tell with this character, their personality and how they'd act in any given situation, feel free to use them whenever, however."

What's stopping most of us is we know how we'd feel if someone took our characters and took them in a direction they were NEVER meant to go.

I'd probably flip my lid if someone turned Caitlin into some kind of sweet saint who never fucked up or made mistakes just as badly as if she somehow metamorphed into a catty bitch who acted like the bitchy teenage cheerleader of every high school movie stereotype.

None of us want to do that to each other.

5 years 7 months ago #19 by rcaffin

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Caitlin as a sweet saint ...
My mind runs into a brick wall there! With barbed wire on top.

Cheers

5 years 7 months ago #20 by Anne

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JG wrote: It's a courtesy thing.

My vision is not Bender's vision is not Elrod's vision is not Bek's vision is not...

You get the idea.

Now there are a few people who I've basically given carte blanche with certain characters, because they've shown they'll stay true to the character as-written.

I won't say which ones, but There's a few.

But the others aren't here to GIVE that carte blanche to the rest of us. They aren't here to say "Joe (or Elrod, or morpheus, or EE, etc) you have a rock-solid handle on the stories i want to tell with this character, their personality and how they'd act in any given situation, feel free to use them whenever, however."

What's stopping most of us is we know how we'd feel if someone took our characters and took them in a direction they were NEVER meant to go.

I'd probably flip my lid if someone turned Caitlin into some kind of sweet saint who never fucked up or made mistakes just as badly as if she somehow metamorphed into a catty bitch who acted like the bitchy teenage cheerleader of every high school movie stereotype.

None of us want to do that to each other.

By the way, this is why, even though I've used Gothmog quite extensively in my micro-scene I haven't actually used him as more than a shadow on a screen, nor will I have him actually find Sara, it is more that I've decided to show what he might do to someone who might know about what happened to Sara if that someone came into his power. Sure he isn't too worried about permanent harm coming to her, but I can't imagine he's as detached as he is made to appear in the last report we have of Hippy approaching the admin about Sara's disappearance. I hope, even though micro-scene work is at best fan-fiction when done by a non-canon author, that I've been true to Bek's vision of Gothmog and what he might do.

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5 years 7 months ago #21 by Valentine

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rcaffin wrote: > the story where Hippolyta and Feral became an item
Sara was in the Crystal Palace (I think) and Hippy rather awkwardly explains that she and Erin are, well... Sara was amused, although slightly disappointed that they felt they had to hide it. I think Title - not sure.

> Jet, from my understanding, needs a sexual encounter to recharge
I missed that one! Jet gave her life force (?) to Sara after Sara was ambushed, leaving a heap of fabric behind, and I thought that was it. Details please?

Anyhow, back to rescuing Sara. What we need seems to be an 'unowned' character to be the lead for the story. I doubt that the informal agreements preclude other owned characters from appearing in the story in supporting roles. So who owns Gypsy, or Winnie, or even Carson?

Cheers

Near the end of Tennyo goes to hell

"I get recharged by sex!" Jet admitted, happily.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 7 months ago #22 by rcaffin

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I plead ignorance about this 'micro-scene'. URL? Please!

Cheers
Roger

5 years 7 months ago #23 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: I plead ignorance about this 'micro-scene'. URL? Please!

Anne's written more than one Micro-Scene that's up for discussion

Bear in mind that the micro scenes aren't canon, which gives a certain leeway for people to test out ideas. For example, I've written Eldritch as a relatively calm and patient person on a few occasions.

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5 years 7 months ago #24 by Anne

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A short cut to the micro-scene I wrote is Here You can always copy that so that you reference it in discussion. It should be noted that microscenes are not canon! Though I did as I note do my best to stay true to what I believe is a reasonable portrayal of Gothmog,.. but as I note, I am not the creator of that character!

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5 years 7 months ago #25 by Kristin Darken

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Note that the micro-scenes, like WhatIF's, are NOT canon.

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5 years 7 months ago #26 by Valentine

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Kristin Darken wrote: Note that the micro-scenes, like WhatIF's, are NOT canon.

Except when Canon Authors write and include them in Canon stories. Imp vs. Hive was microscenes first.

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5 years 7 months ago #27 by Astrodragon

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Of course, you all seem to be assuming Sarah WANTS to be rescued.

Could be she's having such a lovely peaceful break shes perfectly happy where she is :evil:

I love watching their innocent little faces smiling happily as they trip gaily down the garden path, before finding the pit with the rusty spikes.

5 years 7 months ago - 5 years 7 months ago #28 by Sir Lee

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Sorta like this?

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

Last Edit: 5 years 7 months ago by Sir Lee.

5 years 7 months ago #29 by dragonstorm117

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Has anyone thought of how HUNGRY Sara will be When she gets out (weather it will be in the Gen 1 or Gen 2) and who will be the un-luck fool near by when she gets out?

5 years 7 months ago #30 by mhalpern

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dragonstorm117 wrote: Has anyone thought of how HUNGRY Sara will be When she gets out (weather it will be in the Gen 1 or Gen 2) and who will be the un-luck fool near by when she gets out?

depends largely on the nature of her binding. is her body and consciousness active, or is she dormant?

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5 years 7 months ago #31 by null0trooper

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She was conscious as the paper holding the summoning circle was folded up.

Something else to consider: The Kellith is a grand-spawn of Shub-Niggurath and shares a measure of that generative power. Even cut off from the local material universe, she is very unlikely to stay alone in her prison, which may have grown in any and every unconstrained dimension available.

One wonders what would happen if that pocket outside of reality were to be opened within the coordinates warded by that which is the Gate and the Key, assuming that the two spaces can coexist.

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5 years 7 months ago #32 by Sir Lee

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Question to ponder: how much does Sara really need to eat?

I mean, she does not seem to really consume the life force of the beings she eats -- rather, she transport them to her pocket dimension. We have proof (Jet) that it's possible to get out from there, so it's not like it's a "virtual' realm.

Maybe her "eating" is more like filling a balloon, so her pocket dimension can grow. If she doesn't eat, it stops growing -- she will still feel the need, but it won't starve her nor will the hunger keep growing after a point. Or maybe being imprisoned in a magic circle will keep her realm from expanding, and therefore keep her hunger constant, not growing.

Ah well, that's for Bender to explain.

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5 years 7 months ago #33 by Polk Kitsune

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>>

<<

Branwen is definitively working on something for Sara, but that might take some time. That'll be up to her.

For now though, they're working on a project before Halloween, so that takes precedence.

As for finding her, yeah, it's tricky.So much space to look through, and you only have so much time and manpower to look for every nooks and cranny (which is exactly what should have happened), before something else comes up. That initial delay in the search really hurt too.

As someone mentioned that she could multiply and not be alone anymore, you also have to consider that she can't feed either. She'd have no material to create someone else from, outside of her own self, which is already hungry... And then you'd have a second mouth to feed. Not exactly a smart idea.

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5 years 7 months ago #34 by null0trooper

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Polk Kitsune wrote: As someone mentioned that she could multiply and not be alone anymore, you also have to consider that she can't feed either. She'd have no material to create someone else from, outside of her own self, which is already hungry... And then you'd have a second mouth to feed. Not exactly a smart idea.

Are you assuming that The Kellith is still a human character with GOO-ish powers that still needs calories to survive?

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5 years 7 months ago #35 by Polk Kitsune

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null0trooper wrote:
Polk Kitsune wrote: As someone mentioned that she could multiply and not be alone anymore, you also have to consider that she can't feed either. She'd have no material to create someone else from, outside of her own self, which is already hungry... And then you'd have a second mouth to feed. Not exactly a smart idea.

Are you assuming that The Kellith is still a human character with GOO-ish powers that still needs calories to survive?

Don't think I mentioned calories or being human. But she has been needing to feed after all. If it was all but a choice, she wouldn't have been taking dying pets to be dusted in public.

Just because she's a GOO doesn't give carte-blance for 'anything' to happen.

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5 years 7 months ago #36 by Malady

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Assuming everyone's caught up here...

...

...

Wait, no, neither Nimbus nor HM know precisely where Sara is, so she can't be released to be fed into the Black Mirror?

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5 years 7 months ago #37 by Anne

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Malady wrote: Assuming everyone's caught up here...

...

...

Wait, no, neither Nimbus nor HM know precisely where Sara is, so she can't be released to be fed into the Black Mirror?

Are we certain that neither Nimbus nor HM (if they are not one and the same) know where Sara is? What if they know where she is and consider the safest thing they can do is leave her there until the exact moment when they have that summoning circle inside yet another containment vessel that they intend to use to bottle up what is going to be a monumental case of rage at least.....?

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5 years 7 months ago #38 by Valentine

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Anne wrote:
Malady wrote: Assuming everyone's caught up here...

...

...

Wait, no, neither Nimbus nor HM know precisely where Sara is, so she can't be released to be fed into the Black Mirror?
Are we certain that neither Nimbus nor HM (if they are not one and the same) know where Sara is? What if they know where she is and consider the safest thing they can do is leave her there until the exact moment when they have that summoning circle inside yet another containment vessel that they intend to use to bottle up what is going to be a monumental case of rage at least.....?

When she was hidden no one was present, there is no reason to think anyone but Speakeasy knows.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 7 months ago #39 by rcaffin

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Ah - Tennyo goes to Hell. It is a long time since I read those. Thank you.

I suggest Sara will want to be released - to stand with her blood sister against The Bastard. And she might enjoy eating him.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #40 by Inanna

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It sort of kills off the entire universe if a key character can no longer be a major contributor to the overall story when there are already so many plot dependencies written around them being around for the next parts.

What is another writer to do? Its as if you are in a hallway full of doors and they are all locked off to you.

If an author tires of the genre, dies or goes completely off-topic it just takes it all to a grinding halt. That is what has happened to Gen1. No more growth is possible, imagination dies as other authors just have nothing to interplay off of.

Sadly that is what is happening to all of Whateley Academy.

Inanna (tish)

5 years 6 months ago #41 by sam105

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This is a school. There are always more students to open or make more doors. The authors are good enough to keep the story progressing. Where it was slowing up was when they were getting short on active authors. That appears to have been fixed.
Thanks to all of the authors who have found away to keep things going forward.

5 years 6 months ago #42 by Erianaiel

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Valentine wrote: When she was hidden no one was present, there is no reason to think anyone but Speakeasy knows.

Security was told where and how approximately Sara, and the stuff stolen from her, was hidden. I can't remember which story this scene was in.

It was just that security did a haphazard and sloppy job of searching, probably having neither the motivation for a thorough search nor the belief that the information they got was trusthworthy. Speakeasy was a bit more thorough in hiding the incriminating evidence when he believed he might just escape justice for his actions and the security doing the searches did not look past the immediate obvious.

5 years 6 months ago #43 by Inanna

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Yes, yes,... the box on the shelf in the closet.. The piece of tyvekk taped under the bench. We need a lab fire and an angry Kellith to appear in the labs to a new gen of students who don't know about Sara.. then for the first gen to find out when all of those psychic links/ blood sisterhoods become awakened and they run back to the school.

Nikki can't go too far. the World-Tree is in the grove so its not as if she has moved to North Dakota and opened a Sidthe casino on indian lands.

A reunification like that may "force" groups to work together or to choose sides.. The Bastard may have corrupted others in the league or even in TK.

5 years 6 months ago #44 by Kettlekorn

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Inanna wrote: If an author tires of the genre, dies or goes completely off-topic it just takes it all to a grinding halt. That is what has happened to Gen1. No more growth is possible, imagination dies as other authors just have nothing to interplay off of.

Sadly that is what is happening to all of Whateley Academy.

Wow, way to just write off the millions of words the Gen 1 crew have written in the last few years. Elrod and E. E. Nalley have been building a whole cast around Kayda and Lanie to drive the Nimbus and Bastard plots forward, and Kristin has been hinting for ages that Esoteric will become relevant Someday^TM. Then there are all the other fun Gen 1 stories that have nothing to do with Nimbus, the Bastard, or TK; or do Morpheus's, JG's, Phoenix's, and Bek's contributions mean nothing to you?

It sucks that so many individual character plots had to be abandoned or abridged, but to claim that no more growth is possible? Those who say it can't be done shouldn't interrupt those who are doing it.

I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.

5 years 6 months ago #45 by null0trooper

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Inanna wrote: It sort of kills off the entire universe if a key character can no longer be a major contributor to the overall story when there are already so many plot dependencies written around them being around for the next parts.

The "orphaned" characters can still be major contributors to the action without being the "Point of View" protagonists. The big difference is that the story protagonists will mostly only see the masks these characters present to the world, just like the limited view we have of our friends, family, coworkers, etc.

It's also similar to more "real world" situations: some people we count on are transferred, some die, some just find someone else to be invested in, but life still goes on.

Inanna wrote: What is another writer to do? Its as if you are in a hallway full of doors and they are all locked off to you.

Non-canon fan-contributed work can still be written with those characters as protagonists. There just isn't a lot of interest in doing so.

The canon authors still have some idea of what their colleagues intended for their characters' story arcs, so the death of Tennyo at the hands of Squirrel Girl's expy in Year Three can still happen. It's just that those final moments will be depicted through Hank's view of the battle instead of Billie's.

That's what story outlines are all about, right?

Inanna wrote: If an author tires of the genre, dies or goes completely off-topic it just takes it all to a grinding halt. That is what has happened to Gen1. No more growth is possible, imagination dies as other authors just have nothing to interplay off of.

From what I've read, the Whateley Academy project was never meant to be a single author's vision, revolving around one or two protagonists, with all the others busy filling out the trivial or boring parts. If it were, this complaint would make more sense to me.

Perhaps if you could explain what you mean by "growth"? I think we are using different meanings for this word in the context of a body of literature spanning multiple novel-length stories already.

Inanna wrote: ... imagination dies as other authors just have nothing to interplay off of.

Statements like this - characterizing everything not revolving around their favorite character as killing the entire universe, knocking on locked doors, lacking in imagination, amounting to nothing - are sufficient reason for me to never write a story from Jade Sinclair's perspective, unless I'm writing something NSFL.

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5 years 6 months ago #46 by rcaffin

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And yet ... and yet ... it does not seem fair to the characters themselves to abandon them to a Null Hole.
It would not be difficult to rescue Sara while staying 100% inside Canon and without misusing any 'owned' characters. To be sure, the TK characters would be there and active, but they would not be 'central'. There are a number of very useful but 'un-owned' characters who could lead the plot. Yes, I have been thinking about it.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #47 by Valentine

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Erianaiel wrote:
Valentine wrote: When she was hidden no one was present, there is no reason to think anyone but Speakeasy knows.

Security was told where and how approximately Sara, and the stuff stolen from her, was hidden. I can't remember which story this scene was in.

It was just that security did a haphazard and sloppy job of searching, probably having neither the motivation for a thorough search nor the belief that the information they got was trusthworthy. Speakeasy was a bit more thorough in hiding the incriminating evidence when he believed he might just escape justice for his actions and the security doing the searches did not look past the immediate obvious.

Security knows it is looking for a small safe, and a piece of Tyvek about 3 feet square. They have no idea where either are.

Riddle of Sappho wrote: "We're supposed to tear the place apart, looking for a small G-mart safe, and also for a piece of Tyvek, folded or rolled up." Metler started looking around the shelves, including underneath them.

...

Green snorted derisively. "Not asking for much, are they? The safe? Yeah, I can see finding that. But a paper like that? That could be folded up or rolled up and put damned near anywhere, including in the ducts."

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago - 5 years 6 months ago #48 by Inanna

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I mean absolutely no disrespect to the authors; They are doing a fantastic job and I love every story they put out.

For me it is like working on a bid response where I may have a section that I need to write a narrative on. If it does not interlock with the overall design or if someone else drops the ball (professionally speaking) it forces me to go back and rewrite, abandon or tear-out major sections. I may have been thinking one way and playing out a design in my head but then when the overall story has a gap you can't use that part.

For what I do there may be six or seven of us writing a one hundred page response in one night and we each have our specializations (characters) if it does not work together as a whole then there are inconsistencies and the customer tears apart our bid package (the story line).

I have been the contributor of sections, I have also been the ringleader (editor) reading and rereading, editing, to fix inconsistencies. In a bid package the contributors just get to grumble about it. In creative writing it is rather more personal.

It can be fatiguing work when you are getting paid for it and it is on some sort of hard deadline but "its still just a job"... What is done here is personal and its a passion.. its imaginations and dreams... and the real magic of trying to make it work with many different people who all have their own ideas about their characters story and where they would like it to go.

I can understand how someone can get dispirited. I understand that people drop off the face of the Earth or lose interest.. I understand that reading BS on a forum that may seem critical can just make that worse.... SO I mean absolutely no disrespect... I hold the authors in the highest regard and am amazed that they can do this.

Last Edit: 5 years 6 months ago by Inanna.

5 years 6 months ago #49 by rcaffin

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I do not think that expecting Security to find the Tyvek is realistic: that is not how things are done at Whateley. Forget that.

Nikki is Sara's blood sister, but the circle was well made and not even Nikki's powers would suffice to see through the circle. But she does not have to see through the circle: she only has to detect it. Perhaps one cannot detect a circle? Maybe not but then I would expect that, thanks to the Laws of Magic (the Essential Flaw), she should be able to detect an absence of reality just there. In essence, she would be looking for a sort of black hole.

If one cannot sense a circle with Magic, can one sense it with some other sort of power? Just how old are the Tarot cards (in Whateley-verse)? Gypsy has Sara's Mark, so she would have a very strong drive to find Sara. Can she do enough Tarot readings to get her just near the hiding place? After which, Nikki could scan.

Jade is backed by a Demon, even if that demon is unknown. Could that demon spur jade on to motivate Gypsy? This would only make Jade's appearance a minor one: Gypsy would be the lead character as she follows the cards.

I hate situations which end abruptly without some sort of closure. There are too many threads already where that has happened. Bad form.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #50 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: Jade is backed by a Demon, even if that demon is unknown. Could that demon spur jade on to motivate Gypsy? This would only make Jade's appearance a minor one: Gypsy would be the lead character as she follows the cards.

Which Demon is backing Jade?

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5 years 6 months ago #51 by Valentine

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null0trooper wrote:
rcaffin wrote: Jade is backed by a Demon, even if that demon is unknown. Could that demon spur jade on to motivate Gypsy? This would only make Jade's appearance a minor one: Gypsy would be the lead character as she follows the cards.

Which Demon is backing Jade?

Jade isn't backed by a Demon, her mark is from The Star Stalker. The only thing that it would really want to do to Sara is consume her.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #52 by rcaffin

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We don't know.
All we know is that Jade bears a demon mark on her backside (hot tub scene, which led to a confrontation between Nikki and Sara - 'you stupid elf!'), and that the demon nearly withdrew its support (but didn't) when Jade confronted two utter idiots in Dunwich. One of them blew her hand off with jelly, but that did not stop Jade. The demon remained.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #53 by null0trooper

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“It has to be you. You alone. Prove to me that you can do it. Prove that you can hold your own, when it really matters. Show me that when it counts, you can put someone down, and put him down hard!”

That was Billie talking, not a demon, in Jade 8.

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5 years 6 months ago #54 by rcaffin

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Right at the end of jade 8:
Sara wasn’t amused by the jibe. “Oh, nothing much, I suppose.” Her
tone was cold as ice. “I just thought you might care that Jade has a
demon mark.”

There is another mention of the demon somewhere else - I forget where.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #55 by JG

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Inanna wrote: It sort of kills off the entire universe if a key character can no longer be a major contributor to the overall story when there are already so many plot dependencies written around them being around for the next parts.

What is another writer to do? Its as if you are in a hallway full of doors and they are all locked off to you.

If an author tires of the genre, dies or goes completely off-topic it just takes it all to a grinding halt. That is what has happened to Gen1. No more growth is possible, imagination dies as other authors just have nothing to interplay off of.

Sadly that is what is happening to all of Whateley Academy.

Inanna (tish)

I disagree fully with this assessment.

There's ALWAYS something to play off of.

But this is also why Outcast Corner stories aren't dependent upon other authors' characters to be a thing. It's why Kayda stories aren't dependent upon outcasts as a major factor even if they all occasionally dip into other peoples' lives. Some of the Kimbas are in a sort of limbo, but it's only a "Sort of" limbo.

If Mags finds her muse again? If Bender chooses to return?

Until them some of us have a fair idea where some characters were going to go. I have a pretty solid grasp on where Fey was going to go. But Phoenix Spiritus is headed in that direction ANYWAY and the Hank stories are better than ANYTHING I could have concocted for the boy. (spoiler: I was originally offered the right to write Hank, but declined because I don't think I could have done justice)

The only thing that really happened is that the Kimbas were no longer the sole point of central focus for the Whateley Universe. There's enough laid out that other characters can make their mark without impugning upon the original crew.

5 years 6 months ago #56 by Valentine

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Jade 6 Chapter 41 wrote:
Yes, that was a relationship she would grab and hold onto forever. Loyalty to her big sister forever, no matter what. And if the scary face was part of Big Sis? Well, sisters can be like that. She might never understand everything her older sister did or was. But she would love her forever, all the same. Even the scary face. If it was Billie, she loved the scary face, too.
"You don't know... you can't know..." But the face seemed taken aback, under the strength of her loyalty.
Jade wouldn't budge in her feelings.
"Do you have the slightest idea of what I am, and what I demand of you?"
The tone reminded Jade of long discussions with Sara. Sara had discussed her mark. "My mark of ownership," she'd called it.
At one time, Jade had offered to take that and more. Her price had been a female body. Her payment would have been her body, her children, and her soul.
Sara had refused, and it had led to a small fight between them. She wondered if this would feel anything like that. This time, the scary face had offered no payment at all. And although Jade's soul hadn't been mentioned as part of the bargain, she wondered if it might come to that anyway. What was she giving? Her soul? Her life? Everything?
But that wasn't the issue. The question was, who was asking. The scary face was doing the talking, but it was Billie. She felt, and she suddenly saw how they were the same. It didn't matter what the face wanted. This was Billie.
Jade smiled, and accepted completely.
Abruptly, the face smirked. "I see. Then I accept, too."

There's more before this, but it is several pages long and mixed with the Bitslicer crew working.

The only thing associated with Billie is the Scourge/Destroyer/Star Stalker. And I don't remember where, but it mentioned that Jade's "Demon Mark" is a carrot.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #57 by Kristin Darken

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JG wrote: The only thing that really happened is that the Kimbas were no longer the sole point of central focus for the Whateley Universe. There's enough laid out that other characters can make their mark without impugning upon the original crew.

We're not going to try to lie to anyone that Team Kimba wasn't originally intended to be the central plotline for the universe, but I can tell you with absolute certainty that they don't have to be. We are working with a setting that has a large rotating cast of potential characters.

Every new semester or school year invigorates the roster and makes it possible to reinterpret old plots and foreshadowing. That reference from years back about the native american character? Probably meant Heyoka... but did it? Maybe it meant Kayda. Maybe it mean another Native character who you won't meet until the timeline hits 2009. I can guarantee that NO major plotline that was originally created needs to be scrapped entirely. We are perfectly capable of reworking them to redistribute the way events play out. We're also plenty willing to let the TK characters play their pre-assigned roles... we just won't be doing it with them as the protagonist characters.

And as an example of how this is possible... let's talk about the Halloween attack in year one. That invasion was about attacking and taking down Sara. And maybe TK in connection with her. But a lot of that story covered other people. In a big way, it was also Caitlyn/Eldritch's origin story. So sure... if you're focused on Sara as a primary character, you're going to look at that as a Sara/TK story. But if you're an Outcasts fan, its something very different.

Even if the old author team was still around, I think we'd have far more characters being developed than just more and more TK. Maybe not as many as with the inclusion of new authors... but still. There's even a precedent for it. Look at Marvel's X-Men. The original team ran for 91 issues and were then replaced by another team recruited specifically to rescue the original group. Over the years, they ran blue and gold teams, mixed things around, had spin off titles, and so on. Whateley is and will continue to do the same. We've looked at the big plots. Those were never meant to be TK only... they impact the school, the state, the country... and so on. And with the character development we've done now... you can still show you the TK parts... we just won't show them to you with Ayla as PoV character.

Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.

5 years 6 months ago #58 by mhalpern

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Kristin Darken wrote:
JG wrote: The only thing that really happened is that the Kimbas were no longer the sole point of central focus for the Whateley Universe. There's enough laid out that other characters can make their mark without impugning upon the original crew.

We're not going to try to lie to anyone that Team Kimba wasn't originally intended to be the central plotline for the universe, but I can tell you with absolute certainty that they don't have to be. We are working with a setting that has a large rotating cast of potential characters.

Every new semester or school year invigorates the roster and makes it possible to reinterpret old plots and foreshadowing. That reference from years back about the native american character? Probably meant Heyoka... but did it? Maybe it meant Kayda. Maybe it mean another Native character who you won't meet until the timeline hits 2009. I can guarantee that NO major plotline that was originally created needs to be scrapped entirely. We are perfectly capable of reworking them to redistribute the way events play out. We're also plenty willing to let the TK characters play their pre-assigned roles... we just won't be doing it with them as the protagonist characters.

And as an example of how this is possible... let's talk about the Halloween attack in year one. That invasion was about attacking and taking down Sara. And maybe TK in connection with her. But a lot of that story covered other people. In a big way, it was also Caitlyn/Eldritch's origin story. So sure... if you're focused on Sara as a primary character, you're going to look at that as a Sara/TK story. But if you're an Outcasts fan, its something very different.

Even if the old author team was still around, I think we'd have far more characters being developed than just more and more TK. Maybe not as many as with the inclusion of new authors... but still. There's even a precedent for it. Look at Marvel's X-Men. The original team ran for 91 issues and were then replaced by another team recruited specifically to rescue the original group. Over the years, they ran blue and gold teams, mixed things around, had spin off titles, and so on. Whateley is and will continue to do the same. We've looked at the big plots. Those were never meant to be TK only... they impact the school, the state, the country... and so on. And with the character development we've done now... you can still show you the TK parts... we just won't show them to you with Ayla as PoV character.

The only thing foreshadowing regarding a specific character I can think of is Nimbus's intention's for Ayla's younger brother which never got resolved,

Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.

5 years 6 months ago #59 by rcaffin

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But there are so many really loose ends. Is there a Call The Thunder part8? And there are others. So much to do ...

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #60 by null0trooper

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rcaffin wrote: But there are so many really loose ends. Is there a Call The Thunder part8? And there are others. So much to do ...

Cheers

“Diamondback, I hate precogs, but right now I could fucking kiss you.”
...To be concluded in ‘Ashes and Steel’.

mhalpern wrote: The only thing foreshadowing regarding a specific character I can think of is Nimbus's intention's for Ayla's younger brother which never got resolved,

The overall story line is just now passing November 2007. Events plotted for Winter Break and 2008 should not have been released yet.

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5 years 6 months ago #61 by rcaffin

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Argh ... I think I missed Ashes and Steel! I must have been away then.
Thank you!

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #62 by Valentine

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Kristin Darken wrote: .

And as an example of how this is possible... let's talk about the Halloween attack in year one. That invasion was about attacking and taking down Sara. And maybe TK in connection with her. But a lot of that story covered other people. In a big way, it was also Caitlyn/Eldritch's origin story. So sure... if you're focused on Sara as a primary character, you're going to look at that as a Sara/TK story. But if you're an Outcasts fan, its something very different.

Or the first turning point in TNT's lives, the coming out of Gotterdammerung, what leads to Foobs leaving Whateley, the list goes on.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #63 by JG

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rcaffin wrote: But there are so many really loose ends. Is there a Call The Thunder part8? And there are others. So much to do ...

Cheers

It's called "Ashes & Steel"

5 years 6 months ago #64 by rcaffin

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what leads to Foobs leaving Whateley,
Err ... is this published Canon?

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #65 by Ametros

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If you're only reading First Generation stories, I'd say you're doing a disservice. To the community, to the authors, but most of all to yourself. There is plenty of great stuff going on there already.

Seriously, thank you for your time and effort. It is appreciated.

5 years 6 months ago #66 by rcaffin

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Oh no - I read (almost) all the stories, Gen1 & Gen2 & fan fiction etc.
I have to admit though that I find the Gen1 stories more entertaining. They have a certain divine madness about them...

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #67 by Valentine

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rcaffin wrote: what leads to Foobs leaving Whateley,
Err ... is this published Canon?

Cheers

He is not present in Gen 2.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #68 by RoseBlack

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Are we sure he isn't present or have we just not seen him? I like the foob ;_;

5 years 6 months ago #69 by Malady

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He's not at Whateley, but he's also not dead. I think.

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My Patreon. But, support the Crystal Hall 1st?

5 years 6 months ago #70 by RoseBlack

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Yay not dead. Foob is awesome. Wonder where he is though.

5 years 6 months ago #71 by rcaffin

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Foob may be with Carson et al, where-ever they have been imprisoned.

Cheers

5 years 6 months ago #72 by Sir Lee

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It's barely possible, but it does not seem to be the case. His name was never mentioned in the context of the people who disappeared, and the authors have hinted that Foob is alive and has left the campus at some point in the past.

Now, speculation time. A few possible circumstances in which he would leave:
- He achieved at least a partial cure (or perhaps another evolution in his change) that allowed him a degree of mobility and independence. After 20-odd years locked in a glorified fish tank, I think he would like to travel a bit, wouldn't you?
- His powers went berserk and he had to be taken to ARC Black
- His transformation appears to be Mythos-related. It's quite possible that one of the major Mythos-related villains (Nimbus, the Bastard, the Necromancer...) used this link to subvert the Foob in some way (hey, maybe he IS Nimbus). If so, he might be on the run, or in jail, or simply (after being freed from the control) moved somewhere he wouldn't be able to cause too much trouble if it happened again. Like, say, an isolated island, or somewhere in the middle of Nevada.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

5 years 6 months ago #73 by RoseBlack

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I still miss the plushie

5 years 6 months ago #74 by Kristin Darken

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Everyone's favorite super-psychic is no longer in residence at the school. Fub and partner now consult on psychic and mystical security for a variety of government and Fortune 500 contracts in addition to keeping Whateley secure based out of their Appalachian mountain residence/enclave for disfunctional psychics named "Sanctuary." The do (and will visibly) make regular trips to the school to check security, repower wards, and also to teach an occasional class.

Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.

5 years 6 months ago #75 by RoseBlack

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So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.

5 years 6 months ago #76 by Sir Lee

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RoseBlack wrote: So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.

But if he has a tank tank, is it canon that it has cannons?

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

5 years 6 months ago #77 by Valentine

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Sir Lee wrote:
RoseBlack wrote: So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.
But if he has a tank tank, is it canon that it has cannons?

I think maybe Rose was just shooting off at the mouth.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #78 by Kettlekorn

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Valentine wrote:
Sir Lee wrote:
RoseBlack wrote: So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.
But if he has a tank tank, is it canon that it has cannons?

I think maybe Rose was just shooting off at the mouth.

Perhaps we should tread carefully, lest our speculation calls down a punishing barrage.

I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.

5 years 6 months ago #79 by null0trooper

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Kettlekorn wrote:
Valentine wrote:
Sir Lee wrote:
RoseBlack wrote: So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.
But if he has a tank tank, is it canon that it has cannons?

I think maybe Rose was just shooting off at the mouth.
Perhaps we should tread carefully, lest our speculation calls down a punishing barrage.

Just what we'd need: another thread with people going ballistic.

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5 years 6 months ago #80 by Valentine

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null0trooper wrote:
Kettlekorn wrote:
Valentine wrote:
Sir Lee wrote:
RoseBlack wrote: So he's wither out of the tank or he has a tank tank. Yesssssss I can see it now with cannons and everything.
But if he has a tank tank, is it canon that it has cannons?

I think maybe Rose was just shooting off at the mouth.
Perhaps we should tread carefully, lest our speculation calls down a punishing barrage.

Just what we'd need: another thread with people going ballistic.

The thread did start off with a bang.

Don't Drick and Drive.

5 years 6 months ago #81 by E. E. Nalley

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Ok guys, very punny. You've cut us all with your rapier wits, so now let's get back on topic please.

I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it.
Thomas Jefferson, to Archibald Stuart, 1791

5 years 6 months ago #82 by Malady

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If Sara was rescued, what effects would she have on the plots at large... And then we have to account for when she would be rescued... During Gen1, Gen2, in-between, or Gen3 (+)...

Doing it real late might be easiest to write, needing to not account for anything in previous Gens other than tech and society changes?

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5 years 6 months ago #83 by null0trooper

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Malady wrote: If Sara was rescued, what effects would she have on the plots at large... And then we have to account for when she would be rescued... During Gen1, Gen2, in-between, or Gen3 (+)...

Doing it real late might be easiest to write, needing to not account for anything in previous Gens other than tech and society changes?

There was a possible scene posted in the forum with Mrs. Carson visiting Dr. Otto, so at least one of the ideas being kicked around is pre-Gen2, not that dates matter much to Great Old Ones and their spawn.

Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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5 years 6 months ago #84 by RoseBlack

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Actually it was his tank on treads with armor and guns lol.

4 years 6 months ago - 4 years 6 months ago #85 by JulesMorrison

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I know I'm resurrecting a dead thread but dammit, somebody save Sara! Or I'll have to try a proper evocation and see if I can't pull her over into IRL and she can sort it herself
:evil:

Last Edit: 4 years 6 months ago by JulesMorrison.

4 years 6 months ago #86 by Sir Lee

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Well, Bender is around and reportedly doing some writing, so... it's possible.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

4 years 6 months ago #87 by Mister D

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Sir Lee wrote: Well, Bender is around and reportedly doing some writing, so... it's possible.

That's great news.

I hope that all is well with her.

Measure Twice

4 years 6 months ago #88 by JulesMorrison

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Awesomepossum

My best wishes to her.

4 years 6 months ago #89 by lighttech

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Last I heard from her in a chat and PM was 'Working on it"

I took that to mean, "trying to get back on the horse and figure out the new Gen plots?"

But she did make some rather funny comments on my fan fic over at Big Closet! (love them!!!)

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4 years 6 months ago #90 by Erianaiel

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The problem with Sara is that she needs to be depowered some (or a lot) before she can be brought back into the story. A problem she shares with several of the Kimba's.

A creative writer of course can work around the problem but her power is such that The Bastard / The Dark Man needs several orders of magnitude of power boost to be a credible threat for Zulu. Which puts him into the range of 'can split the world with his pinky if not careful'. Or the general powerlevel of the Kimba's needs to be toned down to match his.

It makes writing Sara (or Fey or Tenyo) very challenging indeed, and bringing her back into reality (and the stories) equally difficult.

4 years 6 months ago #91 by JulesMorrison

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My feeling is that that is less of a problem than you'd think. Sara is a baby GOO. She can swing a big stick but she's awkward with it, might not have the knack or know she can do the thing, is liable to be inhibited by stepping too far outside the human, has not had millennia to plot or run tactical analyses, isn't used to very large scale multitasking when she isn't doing it on instinct, has a tendency to act and think like an enhanced human when she definitely isn't one, and really doesn't enjoy topping off her energy.

I feel that a story with Sara in it could afford to be big bads, but it could also focus on her growth into her nature, and show how that is driving a gradual wedge between her and the people who can't think in fifteen dimensions. Or bending them into pretzels as they try to keep up, hello Petra and Jet.

I haven't read all the stories yet so maybe this has already been used... but I feel there is a lot of room. It might just require veering away from the "beat up baddies" formula.

4 years 6 months ago #92 by null0trooper

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JulesMorrison wrote: I haven't read all the stories yet so maybe this has already been used... but I feel there is a lot of room. It might just require veering away from the "beat up baddies" formula.

But we like Sara banging the baddies!

Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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4 years 6 months ago #93 by JulesMorrison

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Like she did with Jobe? *Evil snicker*

4 years 6 months ago #94 by ShadowedSin

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Sara is my heart. She does need saving. Depowering her wouldn't be super difficult, there's tons of mythos to consider such as elder signs. The application perhaps of her form being locked because of the summoning etc.

"I can only conclude that I'm paying off karma at a vastly accelerated rate."
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4 years 6 months ago #95 by JulesMorrison

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Nooo, no depowering the Sara, I like her powerful!

Ahem, blush

4 years 6 months ago #96 by Sir Lee

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Actually, I wouldn't depower Sara directly. What I would do is to make it much harder or impossible for her to go to Daddy Gothmog for help or training. He is the one who's really overpowered and can do world-breaking stuff. Sara might reach that level... in a few millenia.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

4 years 6 months ago #97 by Mister D

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From a narrative PoV, this wouldn't be difficult.

"This is a learning experience that you have to handle by yourself. All baby GOO's have to go through this."

This removes Gothmog from directly intervening in the situation.

Help/advice can be given. "Yes, there IS a solution. You just have to find it."

Also this gives the author the space for Rabbit-Hat-Pulls.

Yes, i'm looking forward to the next instalment, but i'm also willing to wait for the idea's/stories to be fully matured.

They'll be all the sweeter for the wait.

Measure Twice

4 years 5 months ago #98 by Kristin Darken

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If you think about it, the means by which she was put "on the bus" could very easily serve as the solution to any power concerns we might have (assuming power concerns are actually the issue... which, for the most part, are not). By this I mean... Sara, even if 'found' again has been summoned into an entrapment circle that was then folded and lost for a significant period of time. Getting her out of that circle isn't just a straightforward effort of going into a room and going "oh hey, here's that lost circle" and rubbing an escape route through some line of runes or a circle.

Sara and her ability to interact with the WU could be completely redefined into whatever Branwen (formerly Dr Bender) chooses to do with her moving forward. I mean... seriously... if this were Buffy, you know Sara would spend at least one season found, but still stuck in the circle... able to be called up, involved in things, but still trapped at the end of the day. Then the second season, they'd botch a release plan... part of her would be free, life changing events would happen and then, in a moment of sacrifice to prevent someone else getting killed, she'd have to take back the full burden of being the Kellith and it would change all those new relationships and etc.

But I have no doubt that if Branwen WANTS to bring Sara back into action that she can and will find a wonderfully creative way to do so. Instead, I want to ask that people not press so hard to make it that Sara is the only contribution that Branwen can make. She's a wonderful author and we should be happily encouraging ANY return she wishes to make to writing in the universe. Whether that is Sara, another character who you've met already, or something completely new.

Fate guard you and grant you a Light to brighten your Way.

4 years 5 months ago #99 by JulesMorrison

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Kristin Darken wrote: But I have no doubt that if Branwen WANTS to bring Sara back into action that she can and will find a wonderfully creative way to do so. Instead, I want to ask that people not press so hard to make it that Sara is the only contribution that Branwen can make. She's a wonderful author and we should be happily encouraging ANY return she wishes to make to writing in the universe. Whether that is Sara, another character who you've met already, or something completely new.

Absolutely! I may have a particular fondness for this one character (ahem crush ahem), but any writing would be wonderful. Total agreement and support there!

4 years 5 months ago #100 by Sir Lee

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I assume -- from what little she has already posted -- that Branwen has definite plans for what she's doing with Sara. I hope she has plans for other characters too. Like Envy. I think Branwen was also one of the hands behind the Grunts, who could see some author love.

Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.

4 years 5 months ago #101 by ShadowedSin

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*Cackles.*

Someone mentioned Envy...oh Goddess I love her and the Strega.

"I can only conclude that I'm paying off karma at a vastly accelerated rate."
-Commander Susan Ivanova, Earth Force, Babylon 5

4 years 5 months ago #102 by Rose Bunny

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I think it's been said that there are plans for Jet and some of the other members of the pack.

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4 years 5 months ago #103 by Branwen

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There are plans, what happened with them will be in Dissonance part 2. Or should be, since I'm working on starting it now.

4 years 5 months ago #104 by JulesMorrison

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Yay! *Bouncebounce*

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