Question What we now know about Magic... Sorta...

Kristin Darken wrote: Ki is the body's life energy.... It typical spirals outward from our core in numerous spectrum from specific nodal points in the body, along specific branches and channels to and from every point. Some cultures map this out very specifically as can be seen with studies into the Chakra (Hindu) or with acupuncture/pressure. Keeping these energies in balance provides a natural source of health and strength for the body/mind/spirit. As a matter of the nature of energy, some of that 'radiates' off every individual, becoming free form Essence.

Kristin Darken wrote: Essence, like all power flows naturally between points of high density/potential to points of low density/potential. And in moving, it does so along paths that have the least resistance. This forms flows of energy like streams which are pulled into larger and larger ones. Of course, all life forms contribute to these energies... but so does everything else. And the further the ley lines are from the source of energy that produced them... the less that Essence is 'tainted' by its original source. For instance, Essence created by an old graveyard will have a very necromantic taint to it. The power of the sun over a desert generates a very different sort of Essence... as do human beings, animals, trees, and so forth. But as these energies flow faster and faster along the streams and rivers of the ley lines; they are stripped down to a more raw form of Essence. It is that form that the Sidhe have the capacity to tap that humans cannot, even where they are capable of dealing with the torrent/amount of Essence. Humans tend to attract the free floating Essence that is part of the background/ambient. As a result, we're used to working with 'tainted' power... and in fact, rely on it to add the appropriate flavor to spells.

Kristin Darken wrote: As to the questions about the weave healing? You can't ever go back. Only forward. Even if it heals without scarring, it won't be the same as it once was.

Kristin Darken wrote: As to the questions about the weave healing? You can't ever go back. Only forward. Even if it heals without scarring, it won't be the same as it once was.

Kristin Darken wrote:

Malady wrote: Wait... So how does Yin and Yang-ness of Ki play into that, if it's all bio-energy? (Yes, I'm simplifying, it's easier to type?)

What do you mean 'just' bio-energy?

Kristin Darken wrote: Also... how does Yin and Yang not play into that... when you talk about energy cycles, its always about the dynamics between the place from which it comes and the place to which it flows. Yin and Yang are the ultimate metaphor of that dynamic. Where heat flows out of a fire into the night air. Where the low pressure zone draws the heat and moisture to a place where the rain can fall. Where ions gather in one place until energy can be released from the sky in bolts of lightning. Where a Father protects and teaches a son to be strong until that day that the Son becomes the protector. Everything in life is found some stage of dynamic transfer, some balance, between a source and a destination. Using the Ki in martial arts is simply an extension of that understanding, of being aware of the point of balance and tilting it in the direction that yields the greatest advantage while avoiding creating a similar vulnerability in one's own motion and energy.

Kristin Darken wrote: The Middle realms are the most abstract and wild of the spirit realms and are rarely, if ever, reached by even the most practiced shaman. This is the home of the spirits of the abstract nature: the wind, the water, the trees and sky, etc. They are a primordial place, touched by little except the most important worship sites and ruins of the greatest enduring civilizations. What we've accomplished in North America since arriving back in 1500(ish) amounts to very little there. 500 years doesn't mean much to the Wind or the Mountains.

The Ethereal plane is where you will find the 'Mystic planes'... it is a place of ideals and concepts. The Akashic Library (the storehouse of the collected knowledge of humanity) can be found and studied there. It takes a powerful mind and Will to function there, let alone understand and make use of the place... and generally cannot be reached without powerful magick and/or Psychic training. Additionally it is extremely dangerous because, like the spirit realms, it is in habited with beings native to it... and they are often far too powerful for being not of the ethereal realm to control.

Kristin Darken wrote: The difference between a regular mage and a ki mage is like the difference between an Energizer blaster and an Energizer brick.

The both of a small internal source of energy and a large external one that complements and adds to their internal source. But one of them uses that energy to fill up a tank that can be tapped to create external effects. The other uses that energy constantly throughout their body to create internal effects. Both 'technically' have the ability to do both internal and external stuff, but the way they go about it is different and mainly depends on either having that fuel tank available or on having their body adapted to handle the constant flow of energies through the body.

What has kept Chaka alive where other ki mages fail is that her energy flows work naturally in a balanced format... the energy is both pushed and pulled through its patterns. Where ki mages often fail is that it is all about one side... either push or pull. In a push only system, energy flows in, fills all the channels and has to escape to somewhere... so you are always constantly burning energy just to keep from being cooked alive from the inside. Pull driven ki mages would basically consume themselves they would either have erratic control as one ability siphoned off strength for another, or they would try to pull power in from vital sources.

Kristin Darken wrote: The difference between a regular mage and a ki mage is like the difference between an Energizer blaster and an Energizer brick.

The both of a small internal source of energy and a large external one that complements and adds to their internal source. But one of them uses that energy to fill up a tank that can be tapped to create external effects. The other uses that energy constantly throughout their body to create internal effects. Both 'technically' have the ability to do both internal and external stuff, but the way they go about it is different and mainly depends on either having that fuel tank available or on having their body adapted to handle the constant flow of energies through the body.

What has kept Chaka alive where other ki mages fail is that her energy flows work naturally in a balanced format... the energy is both pushed and pulled through its patterns. Where ki mages often fail is that it is all about one side... either push or pull. In a push only system, energy flows in, fills all the channels and has to escape to somewhere... so you are always constantly burning energy just to keep from being cooked alive from the inside. Pull driven ki mages would basically consume themselves they would either have erratic control as one ability siphoned off strength for another, or they would try to pull power in from vital sources.

E. E. Nalley wrote: For example; it is entirely possible for a student in mystic algebra to go through a series of complex computations, arrive at an answer that is mathematically incorrect, and still have their spell work.

Likewise, it seems that for energizers... it is not so much but how many calories were eaten, but does the Energizer "feel" like they ate enough.

Malady wrote: So... Given this:
So, for Mystic Algebra Magic, it's not precisely about having the correct math, and more about how much effort the mage put in, I guess?

Although, there might need to be a consensus that the math is at least sort of right, in its process, or else the spell fails...

Tom Lehrer wrote: But in the new [math] approach, as you know, the important thing is to understand what you're doing, rather than to get the right answer.

Arcanist Lupus wrote:

Tom Lehrer wrote: But in the new [math] approach, as you know, the important thing is to understand what you're doing, rather than to get the right answer.

Arcanist Lupus wrote: But when does calculating become thinking? As of four days ago, Computers have triumphed over Go Grandmasters. Go can't be mastered by brute force calculation. Is the computer thinking? If not, what is it doing, and how is that different from what a grandmaster does?

AlphaGo works in two parts. When it is the computer’s turn, the program first suggests moves based on the sorts of general tactics that human players have used in the past—much as Deep Blue would. Then the second part of the system sifts those moves for those that look like they might lead to a win, again based on patterns it has picked up through memorising zillions of previous games.

Kristin Darken wrote:

Valentine wrote: Since I doubt the Grandmaster has memorized "zillions" of previous games, the computer is not doing what the Grandmaster does.

Actually, it's not a zillion games of memorization that matters. Its the recognition that every game of Go is made up of a number of smaller games of Go. And each of those smaller games is also made up of smaller games of Go. And within the context of every large game of Go there are a number of smaller pieces of that game that can reflect an 'end game' pattern at any moment. Each of these smaller games are interwoven in such a way that to place one in final winning state can trigger the correct or incorrect completion to adjacent smaller games.

So you don't need to memorize zillions of previous games... you only need to observe the completion of one smaller piece and integrate that completion into the completion pattern of its neighbor... and the one beyond that... and so on, until your combination of patterns has completed the entirety of your gameboard.

Malady wrote: So, in the Odds and Ends Part 2 , we learned that Orthodox Thaumaturgy assigns Secrecy to Saturn, or vice-versa... Now, is that Saturn the Planet, or Saturn the Titan? Or even not really Saturn, but some reference to one of the lesser known Saturn gods... Hmm...

@Cabalists - Could you tell us what Real Life basis that connection comes from, or did you guys make it up for Whateley?

E. E. Nalley wrote:

Malady wrote: So, in the Odds and Ends Part 2 , we learned that Orthodox Thaumaturgy assigns Secrecy to Saturn, or vice-versa... Now, is that Saturn the Planet, or Saturn the Titan? Or even not really Saturn, but some reference to one of the lesser known Saturn gods... Hmm...

@Cabalists - Could you tell us what Real Life basis that connection comes from, or did you guys make it up for Whateley?

It was Saturn, these short-lived General Motors consumer brand of mostly plastic cars. It's always been a complete mystery why GM thought that would work.

Well, this spell looks like something from before the Sundering. Unfortunately, I am not familiar with this type of magic. I can tell that two mages worked this spell, one male and one female.” commented Rythax, sitting back and looking down at the spell.