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Question Sunshine and Fury

7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #1 by Iwasforger03
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  • I'm about halfway through it now.

    Heart with J + D in it.

    Joe/Jericho or Jack + Deimos or Diamondback? Heck, it could be Jerich/Diamond AND Jack/Deimos (or flipped a bit).

    I'd say we just narrowed, very very slightly, the field of potential shipping and confirmed that romance CAN blossom between the Outcasts.


    On chaka - I think Okami just doesn't know Chaka is Toni's codename, but she probably DOES know who Toni is...

    Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Iwasforger03.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #2 by Malady
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  • So long... Loving the DoubleMeaningTitle or whatever!

    That ending! Like what? Who's that new person? ... What's going on with Hikaru?

    And that plan at the beginning is set up for an arc? Or did it actually conclude during the story?

    The purpose of Melville. Very interesting, and explains why Tia was sent there...

    We get some info on Energizer biology...

    “You’re somewhere at a halfway point physically between an energizer, and a WIZ-trait that doesn’t have a lit well.”


    So Unlit Wizes have special biologies too? Adapting to the Ess filled enviro? Turning into a Sidhe-ish??

    I wonder how Amateratsu's gonna be once she learns the truth about the object of her ire?

    There was some clash between spirit and host! Interesting!
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Malady.
    7 years 10 months ago #3 by Iwasforger03
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  • I'm enjoying Hikaru more everytime I read her.

    Was this before or after the burn out that caused her to forget Laura? And I can't tell if she was disparaging Morgan's affectionately or as an insult. If insult, I don't get why she called her that...

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    7 years 10 months ago #4 by Dreamer
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  • SPOILER ALERT
    Below is a stream of conscious commentary I type up as I read the story. There will details from the story included in it. If you have not read the story yet and don't wish to have details of it spoiled, read no further.


    Sunshine & Fury comments
    Warning: Spoiler! [ Click to expand ]

    Thank You for story comments appreciated and help me know me they are being read and liked. :-) Note: My story comments can't nor are trying to replace reading the stories, simply my way of enjoying them and letting the authors know I enjoy them.
    7 years 10 months ago #5 by Yolandria
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  • Heart with J + D in it.


    *Hands out Swedish Fish* I seriously doubt it would be any pair of the OC crew. The reason behind that. They would use their given names.... So it could be Joe +...Or Janine + Or Jack +...Now we just need to find out who the D belonged too.

    Mistress of the shelter for lost and redeemable Woobies!
    7 years 10 months ago #6 by DanZilla
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  • It's obviously Jack and Diane... Why?

    'cuz if it was S+D it would be Sam and Diane...
    7 years 10 months ago #7 by JG
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  • Better than S+M
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #8 by Iwasforger03
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  • Dimes? The outcasts used their nicknames in their code names as often as they use their real names. Both when talking to each other and when talking to Outsiders. Also if this was the outcast special place it thenmakes no sense that they would have brought anyone but another Outcast into it. Nor carved a mark like that, if it included a mark from someone who wasn't an outcast, within their special place.

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Iwasforger03.
    7 years 10 months ago #9 by Katssun
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  • While I unpack the rest of this, it was nice to see the reason why the board picked Le Compte as Headmaster over Caitlin and then get Falcon as his assistant. Caitlin would spend too much time fussing over all of the students and getting pissed off over the admin stuff and funding...and politics...and bureaucracy. Mazarin can keep her focused on the students who need her the most, the potentially self-destructive magic oddballs, Hikaru, Morgana, and so on.

    The normal students can love Falcon and the staff will get sorted out by Mazarin's plan with Caitlin...who just so happens to be on his side anyway now that he's revealed that he is focused on the well-being of the students who need Whateley unique staff to help them be safe.

    One question though. Why don't we know Ellison's first name? Following the Path of Cute seemed to show she was a ex-hero who had a magical girl theme, but this story, I kept getting confused and thinking it was Seraphim, who has equal tendencies to get caught up in the moment of things. Both having blond hair and blue eyes. At least I don't think they're the same person, or Kerry picked up some really weird preferences after graduating. Miss Sparkle doesn't quite have the same ring to Seraphim.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #10 by Iwasforger03
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  • Nah no way that they are the same two people. Eldritch would get along much better with Kerry than she would with Ellison.

    Any chance someone can clarify what Hikaru* meant about Morgana?



    *My autocorrect changed hikaru to hilary for some asinine reason...

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Iwasforger03.
    7 years 10 months ago #11 by MageOhki
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  • what do you mean?
    7 years 10 months ago #12 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • Miss Ellison is unlikely to be Kerry. Not unless she's undergone a massive personality shift. Kerry was a reluctant girl, and while I could see her embracing her feminine side, I can't imagine her jumping into a full Magical Girl shtick, much less reviving Wondercute.

    Kerry does have a younger sister, but she was 10 in 2007, and that puts her a little young to be a teacher, much less have a career as a magical girl before that.


    Love the Imp VI. I bet Imp loves it too. It does remind me a bit of the Shoulder Angels. I wonder how much future VI tech was born in those few chaotic days? (Also, checking the wiki, it took less than a week for the shoulder angels to spiral out of control. Wow)

    It bothers me far more than it should that Hikaru was misquoting "We're off to see the Wizard". I think a large part of it is that I can't get the words she used to match the melody properly.


    Brain damage is scary. It's bad enough for someone like Roulette, who knows that they might go into burnout and die at any time. But Hikaru is loosing parts of herself - important parts - every time she overexerts, and she's not going to be able to get those parts back. Caitlyn chose to leave Eric Mahren behind for the safety and sanity of all concerned. Daniel Moates is dying by inches.

    It would be interesting for Hikaru to talk to the Wylanns.

    I like Le Compte. Anyone taking bets on whether he's part of SMILE?

    Kenshin, like Danny, has attracted a harem to fight his battles for him. It's funny how differently he reacts to the situation.

    I wonder what's going on with Hikaru's sword that Caitlyn doesn't want her messing with?

    It's interesting to see that Nikki is a full-time member of the Whateley staff. Makes sense though. It's safe (from a certain point of view), and she'll want to keep an eye on the World Tree seedling. And as sidhe are reborn into the world, any that follow a mutation path like Nikki did are more likely to end up at Whateley than anywhere else.

    Very curious about the mission at the very end. So many questions that I don't even know where to start.

    I just don’t know how much of the old Dragonslayer is still there and how much has been replaced by the eternally angry Mama-Bear.”

    You say 'tomato', I say 'tomato' *. Caitlyn's purpose has never altered, and her methods haven't really changed. All that's different is her focus and targets.

    *it doesn't make much sense when you read it.

    "Shared pain is lessened; shared joy, increased — thus do we refute entropy." - Spider Robinson
    7 years 10 months ago #13 by Katssun
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  • It's pretty funny that Hikaru spends much of the story taking personal notes on who she's going to try and poach and lure to Japan the next four years.

    Also looking forward to the Playboy Thanksgiving, hehehe. Tia tricks Hikaru again!

    @MageOhki:

    I believe Forger is referring to this paragraph, because I had to read it a few times myself and it only makes sense when you combine Cait's discussions/exercises with Hikaru and the earlier context of Cait raging at the other staff about not being told what Hikaru is capable of until just now:

    Hikaru rolled her eyes at both the teacher and the goddess. “Oh, I know better than to think sticking my palms in fire is a good idea.” Snorting. “And you feel warm. It’s how I can put up with you. Must be your essence.” Musing. “Explains why I’m not too angry at Dragonsfyre the annoying little wanna be bitch.” Pausing, eyeing her hands. “Well, doesn’t seem to be regenerating that fast, though this is the first time I’ve actually got a sunburn since well...”

    So please correct me if I'm wrong: What Hikaru is saying or joking about Morgana is a comparison of the two of them. Hikaru basically is Amaterasu. She is the shining heavens itself, and converts the sun to essence. The solar essence transformer, producing too much for her body to handle. Morgana was grafted through demonic ritual to the plane of fire to rip and convert essence from it as effectively as possible, and to be used as a battery by the cult.

    Hikaru and Amaterasu seem to be a bit offended by the similarity.

    Morgana is a wannabe essence radiator. Hikaru is the real deal. She's comparing their capacity, and a fire to the sun. One the electrical transformer, the other a rechargeable battery. Morgana was intended to be what Hikaru could be used for if the wrong people give her enough burnouts.

    Arcanist Lupus wrote: It bothers me far more than it should that Hikaru was misquoting "We're off to see the Wizard". I think a large part of it is that I can't get the words she used to match the melody properly.

    Brain damage is scary. It's bad enough for someone like Roulette, who knows that they might go into burnout and die at any time. But Hikaru is loosing parts of herself - important parts - every time she overexerts, and she's not going to be able to get those parts back. Caitlyn chose to leave Eric Mahren behind for the safety and sanity of all concerned. Daniel Moates is dying by inches.

    This was my take as well. It's like each burnout scoops out a chunk of Daniel (with bits of Hikaru to boot), that gets rebuilt as best as she can by Amaterasu, leaving Hikaru more and more 'Hikaru' every time. It's more terrifying that her friends are seeing it first hand, while Hikaru doesn't really know why she doesn't know what she lost, or if she should really be upset by it. Not knowing who Chicken is to her anymore hurts Tyson so much more than the little confusion Hikaru feels.

    Kenshin, like Danny, has attracted a harem to fight his battles for him. It's funny how differently he reacts to the situation.

    I enjoyed the much scarier side to Kenshin that Hikaru has been hinting at from the beginning. When he lets go, he's gonna let go big. Probably when one of the harem girls gets hurt defending him. Whoever does it is going to get plastered over a wall, and nobody will know who did it. :unsure:
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #14 by MageOhki
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  • Katssun wrote: It's pretty funny that Hikaru spends much of the story taking personal notes on who she's going to try and poach and lure to Japan the next four years.

    It is a reason to be at Whateley, or so she was sold on...

    Also looking forward to the Playboy Thanksgiving, hehehe. Tia tricks Hikaru again!

    We ARE planning to write the SoCal Turkey day.

    @MageOhki:

    I believe Forger is referring to this paragraph, because I had to read it a few times myself and it only makes sense when you combine Cait's discussions/exercises with Hikaru and the earlier context of Cait raging at the other staff about not being told what Hikaru is capable of until just now:

    Hikaru rolled her eyes at both the teacher and the goddess. “Oh, I know better than to think sticking my palms in fire is a good idea.” Snorting. “And you feel warm. It’s how I can put up with you. Must be your essence.” Musing. “Explains why I’m not too angry at Dragonsfyre the annoying little wanna be bitch.” Pausing, eyeing her hands. “Well, doesn’t seem to be regenerating that fast, though this is the first time I’ve actually got a sunburn since well...”

    So please correct me if I'm wrong: What Hikaru is saying or joking about Morgana is a comparison of the two of them. Hikaru basically is Amaterasu. She is the shining heavens itself, and converts the sun to essence. The solar essence transformer, producing too much for her body to handle. Morgana was grafted through demonic ritual to the plane of fire to rip and convert essence from it as effectively as possible, and to be used as a battery by the cult.

    Completely wrong. Sorry. Hikaru doesn't like Morgana for one simple reason. Morgana in Calamari, tried to go all 'alpha' on her, when Hikaru went "Meh, Kenshin's not slicing and dicing, no need for me." and Hikaru has been around enough real deal 'alphas' to not be impressed by a wanna be.
    Smallest dog barks loudest.

    Arcanist Lupus wrote: It bothers me far more than it should that Hikaru was misquoting "We're off to see the Wizard". I think a large part of it is that I can't get the words she used to match the melody properly.

    Gets better when you realize she has no singing voice...


    Brain damage is scary. It's bad enough for someone like Roulette, who knows that they might go into burnout and die at any time. But Hikaru is loosing parts of herself - important parts - every time she overexerts, and she's not going to be able to get those parts back. Caitlyn chose to leave Eric Mahren behind for the safety and sanity of all concerned. Daniel Moates is dying by inches.

    This was my take as well. It's like each burnout scoops out a chunk of Daniel (with bits of Hikaru to boot), that gets rebuilt as best as she can by Amaterasu, leaving Hikaru more and more 'Hikaru' every time. It's more terrifying that her friends are seeing it first hand, while Hikaru doesn't really know why she doesn't know what she lost, or if she should really be upset by it. Not knowing who Chicken is to her anymore hurts Tyson so much more than the little confusion Hikaru feels.

    Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeep.

    Kenshin, like Danny, has attracted a harem to fight his battles for him. It's funny how differently he reacts to the situation.

    I enjoyed the much scarier side to Kenshin that Hikaru has been hinting at from the beginning. When he lets go, he's gonna let go big. Probably when one of the harem girls gets hurt defending him. Whoever does it is going to get plastered over a wall, and nobody will know who did it. :unsure:[/quote]
    heheheheh.

    Thank you for reading
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by MageOhki.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #15 by Katssun
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  • Thanks for the clarification. I'll have to reread that part in Calamari.

    MageOhki wrote: Gets better when you realize she has no singing voice...

    So the "Voice of the Heavens"..."I knew you were an idol singer!" joke is only going to get better?!

    “Though that reminds me. I do need to call Kako. It shouldn’t take this long to get a car.”

    Hmm...is someone particularly jealous of somebody else's 918 Spyder?

    What is Kako looking for? A Lexus LFA? A Nissan GT-R or a 370Z? The 370Z seems a little tame though. A Honda NSX (Acura for the US!)? Something older like a customized S2000?
    (Special thanks to Wikipedia)

    edit:
    Ooo, maybe a refurbished classic boxy mountain racer Supra that all the Gearheads will drool over.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Katssun.
    7 years 10 months ago #16 by Iwasforger03
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  • @ Katssun and Ohki - Yeah, that bit about Morgana. Thanks for clearing that up.

    @Everyone - Is this before or after the scene where Hikaru doesn't remember Laura?

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    7 years 10 months ago #17 by Katssun
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  • Skimming it over again, the fact that Hikaru shows up to a driving class in a red and gold zippered catsuit when the only requirement is don't wear your uniform.

    How is she not in Venus Inc. yet?
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #18 by Malady
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  • Oh right, Kenshin. ... He's a lot more bothered by things than he lets on. That calm is a real solid mask, and when he lets loose, he might be rager or UV classified??

    Wait a sec. He's an actual ChildSoldier. The FUCK? He's been hired to be Hikaru's bodyguard-ish, no? And he's not an adult in any sense, unlike Hikaru... Argh.

    ... ChildSoldier, magical... MagicalGuy??

    ... Censorship Guys, wiping pics from the net... Did that actually work? Rigid control is mega chafing!
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Malady.
    7 years 10 months ago #19 by Iwasforger03
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  • He's supposed to have the powers of fighting game characters. That problably includes regenerating himself, his clothing.... possibly stock sound effects, and maybe even some variant of the "Ki Wizard" trait Chaka had. I imagine he's insanely powerful when he cuts loose completely, and insanely dangerous. It seems like the main reason he's at Whateley instead of ninja school (yama dojo) is that he wouldn't be able to behave well enough at ninja school, so they hoped Whateley could handle him?

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    7 years 10 months ago #20 by Malady
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  • And just to bring these points up again: Galahad and Heracles Syndromes. How much is Kenshin hit by it?

    Japan is behind on mutant biology. That could relate to the above, and Deidricks as well...
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #21 by MageOhki
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  • Katssun wrote: Thanks for the clarification. I'll have to reread that part in Calamari.

    MageOhki wrote: Gets better when you realize she has no singing voice...

    So the "Voice of the Heavens"..."I knew you were an idol singer!" joke is only going to get better?!

    Yep.

    “Though that reminds me. I do need to call Kako. It shouldn’t take this long to get a car.”

    Hmm...is someone particularly jealous of somebody else's 918 Spyder?

    Not of the car itself but having a car. Hikaru kinda thinks the Spyder's a bit overdone, personally.

    What is Kako looking for? A Lexus LFA? A Nissan GT-R or a 370Z? The 370Z seems a little tame though. A Honda NSX (Acura for the US!)? Something older like a customized S2000?
    (Special thanks to Wikipedia)

    edit:
    Ooo, maybe a refurbished classic boxy mountain racer Supra that all the Gearheads will drool over.

    Hikaru ordered a 370Z Roadster.
    or that's what she _wanted_ (In Japan they're the Z35 Fair Lady, IIRC)

    Iwasforger03 wrote: @ Katssun and Ohki - Yeah, that bit about Morgana. Thanks for clearing that up.

    @Everyone - Is this before or after the scene where Hikaru doesn't remember Laura?

    It's why acutally, this is the reference scene to why, so it's kinda during.

    Katssun wrote: Skimming it over again, the fact that Hikaru shows up to a driving class in a red and gold zippered catsuit when the only requirement is don't wear your uniform.

    How is she not in Venus Inc. yet?

    Sexy Exemplars females aren't quite a dime a dozen on Whateley, but close enough. Males who can be talked into modeling? Bit different story. IT's quite possible that they haven't gotten around to headhunting out the new froshies, beyond Tia, who they already knew was coming and had a contract.

    Or remember, it's only been about 2 weeks, so...
    Also: that catsuit is fire resistant, leather(somewhat thick), properly designed to keep heat out, and armored to a degree. Tia calls it a catsuit (since Hikaru tends to go for semi skintight in these cases), but it's more a professional high risk racesuit.

    Malady wrote: Oh right, Kenshin. ... He's a lot more bothered by things than he lets on. That calm is a real solid mask, and when he lets loose, he might be rager or UV classified??

    Wait a sec. He's an actual ChildSoldier. The FUCK? He's been hired to be Hikaru's bodyguard-ish, no? And he's not an adult in any sense, unlike Hikaru... Argh.

    ... ChildSoldier, magical... MagicalGuy??

    ... Censorship Guys, wiping pics from the net... Did that actually work? Rigid control is mega chafing!

    In order: Might end up as UV, no he isn't, not really, no, no and it works more than it doesn't.

    Iwasforger03 wrote: He's supposed to have the powers of fighting game characters. That problably includes regenerating himself, his clothing.... possibly stock sound effects, and maybe even some variant of the "Ki Wizard" trait Chaka had. I imagine he's insanely powerful when he cuts loose completely, and insanely dangerous. It seems like the main reason he's at Whateley instead of ninja school (yama dojo) is that he wouldn't be able to behave well enough at ninja school, so they hoped Whateley could handle him?


    Eh. Not really a spoiler, but Kenshin's power rating from DOPS/IOPS, is : EX-3, ESP-1(undefined as they don't know what it is, and remember ESP ratings are 'how controlled it is', not how powerful), Man-3, and Re-3.
    that's it.
    He'd technically qualify as a Wiz-0, possibly, depening on how the ki arts are viewed, more or less, he knows the basics enough to sense and do a 'few' tricks.

    And yes, the reason he's at Whateley boils down to: "Yama dojo trains those who fit what we teach" And Kenshin does not

    Malady wrote: And just to bring these points up again: Galahad and Heracles Syndromes. How much is Kenshin hit by it?

    Japan is behind on mutant biology. That could relate to the above, and Deidricks as well...

    Galahad, mostly, but a Japanese variant (the 'noble samurai'), to some extent, though he isn't that bad. And no, Japan's actually pretty equal to the average for first world nations (no one's as good as Whateley or ARC, but that's a different story), on paranormal issues, maybe a bit more in some areas. Where Japan falls down involves the telepathic group of powers. Empathy and ESP also somewhat fall down, though it'd depend on the ESP variant.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by MageOhki.
    7 years 10 months ago #22 by Sir Lee
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  • Katssun wrote: Hmm...is someone particularly jealous of somebody else's 918 Spyder?

    What is Kako looking for? A Lexus LFA? A Nissan GT-R or a 370Z? The 370Z seems a little tame though. A Honda NSX (Acura for the US!)? Something older like a customized S2000?
    (Special thanks to Wikipedia)

    edit:
    Ooo, maybe a refurbished classic boxy mountain racer Supra that all the Gearheads will drool over.

    Thing is, the Spyder is a limited-production supercar, with prices starting at 847K. Tia's is probably more expensive, with all the customizations. All of those you mentioned are regular production cars costing from 5% to 40% of the price of the Porsche.
    If Hikaru were jealous of the car (something that MageOhki has already dispelled), none of those would have helped in upstaging Tia.
    Japanese car makers don't have a big story of custom supercars. If Hikaru wanted something comparable to Tia's, she would have to go European. But she doesn't, she just wants a nice car.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #23 by Sir Lee
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  • Regarding Fey's presence at Whateley... I also think it makes sense, but for a slightly different reason.

    Back then, Aunghandail had Nikki's life pretty much planned for her. She would become a model to attain fame and money, and would then leverage that into diplomacy, in order to lead the Sidhe into resurgence.

    Now that Aung's is out of the picture, Nikki is finding how much she was being manipulated by the ancient Sidhe. It's not unlikely that she will find a different path. Her modeling career took a slight setback (well, "slight" in Sidhe years - there are probably a few ad agencies angry at how subpar her recent photos were, and dismissing her as an unreliable flake -- but she can afford to wait a few decades until they forget about it, if she wants to); the kind of magic she relied on proved to have important shortcomings. Would it be surprising, really, if she decided to dedicate a decade or two to magical research? And what better place for that than Whateley? And yes, the presence of the Grove and the World Tree seedling would be a factor, but not a deciding one -- when she decided to plant the seed there, she wasn't planning on tying herself to babysitting it.

    Re: Ellison... some possibilities:
    1. She's Seraphim. Really unlikely, despite the coincidence of name and appearance. First, different powers. Second, different personality. Third, she and Eldritch don't seem to really know each other well (Eldritch does not call her by her first name, to begin with) -- which would be really odd after years working together in the forging of magical artifacts.
    2. She's Seraphim's younger sister Madison. Barely possible, although Madison seems too young to have had a career as a Magical Girl. But who knows, she might have become a (non-mutant) Magical Girl in her tweens... I mean, that's the age where somebody would think adopting a Magical Girl guise is a good idea.
    3. She's Seraphim's older brother Ray, who has magical talent and was sent to study under Master Zheng. Who knows, he may have had a "Sparkling Generation Valkyrie Yuuki" event... and this IS Whateley, where gender-change events do happen fairly often. As for the somewhat ditzy personality, who knows how becoming a Magical Girl might affect him...
    4. She's Seraphim's mom, magically rejuvenated. Somehow, I don't think so. Again, wrong personality.
    5. She's someone else, and the name and appearance are just a coincidence.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Sir Lee.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #24 by Malady
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  • “Only real tradition regarding blades, is that you don’t unsheath them without them tasting blood before you put them back to rest.”


    DrawSwordDrawBlood is interesting... I guess that's a deliberate divergence from real life, for some reason? But, “Live steel is never drawn in a spar.” Training is all wood?

    she’s too tight to one bloodline to ever answer anyone’s call.


    Doesn't that mean noone can use it? Or... I guess Eldritch means that Hametsu can only be wielded by a Amateratsu descendant? Or a descendant of a descendant or something? A dead bloodline?
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Malady.
    7 years 10 months ago #25 by MageOhki
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  • As for Japanese supercars, there's two very well known ones, Sir Lee.
    LFA and GT-R. While the LFA can (and has) gone toe to toe with anything the Euros put out, the GT itself is only 150k, and 90-95% of the performance of the LFA.
    7 years 10 months ago #26 by mhalpern
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  • I am guessing where Japan is behind on esp and related fields, they are ahead in divisors and gadgeteers,

    Any Bad Ideas I have and microscene OC character stories are freely adoptable.
    7 years 10 months ago #27 by null0trooper
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  • JG wrote: Better than S+M


    Such a thing exists?

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #28 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • Okay, I need to get this out of my head.

    "Sunshine and Fury and whiskers on kittens
    Bright copper kettles and warm woolen mittens,
    Brown paper packages tied up with strings,
    These are a few of my favorite things."

    "Shared pain is lessened; shared joy, increased — thus do we refute entropy." - Spider Robinson
    7 years 10 months ago #29 by Iwasforger03
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  • null0trooper wrote:

    JG wrote: Better than S+M


    Such a thing exists?


    Good question. I do wonder what the...

    Sandra + Monica? Dude, please tell me that wasn't an incest joke...

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    7 years 10 months ago #30 by MageOhki
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  • Somewhat. In 'how' they're 'ulititized', ya, agreed. In Derdrick's, and like? Note in Islands the 'solution' they're coming up with.

    This isn't to say Japan is 'paranormal' heaven. While, yes, outside the Ryukyus, anti mutant feelings are zip, etc, etc... Japan is not pro psi one little bit, they're somewhat weak (to be fair, this is an in general, not just paranormal) on psychology issues, there's a very strong 'conform' 'tude, etc, etc... There's 'lifetime' (both good and bad implications, btw. Corps tend to expect their gadegetters stay with them.... for life.)
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #31 by Domoviye
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  • Good story, it was interesting seeing Caitlin and Hikaru interacting. I'm not sure which is going to be more amusing seeing them working together or getting on each other's last nerves.

    And are we going to see more of that poor girl who was rescued or is she just to there to show what Whateley will do to protect a student?
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Domoviye.
    7 years 10 months ago #32 by Katssun
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  • MageOhki wrote: Corps tend to expect their gadegetters stay with them.... for life.)

    Do Japanese Gadgeteers not mind the 80 hour work weeks? Or would that just be their devisors?
    7 years 10 months ago #33 by Domoviye
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  • Katssun wrote:

    MageOhki wrote: Corps tend to expect their gadegetters stay with them.... for life.)

    Do Japanese Gadgeteers not mind the 80 hour work weeks? Or would that just be their devisors?


    Neither mutant type is really happy with 80 hour work weeks, but that's why there's overtime. Nearly unlimited overtime keeps them happy.
    7 years 10 months ago #34 by Katssun
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  • A lot of Japanese companies have employment contracts with "service overtime" where the first 20-40 hours are unpaid.

    My company here in the States has what we jokingly call "free time" where salary employees don't get paid for the first 5 or 10 hours of overtime depending on your rank (e.g. supervisors are expected to put in more time, and thus give 10 for free), but you do get overtime once you go over.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #35 by Malady
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  • Domoviye wrote:

    Katssun wrote:

    MageOhki wrote: Corps tend to expect their gadegetters stay with them.... for life.)

    Do Japanese Gadgeteers not mind the 80 hour work weeks? Or would that just be their devisors?


    Neither mutant type is really happy with 80 hour work weeks, but that's why there's overtime. Nearly unlimited overtime keeps them happy.


    Lol. ... But seriously, do you mean ResignationsNotAccepted??? :blink: ... "Accidents" are not unexpected...

    Or just the normal InItForLife? ... Well, they're Japanese too, presumably, so they're used to the culture, so that's why they stay? ... They could just use the Gen1 Chinese method of recruitment, which would be bad if it got out, but it's not gonna get out...

    ... Why am I so negative?? 'Cause government black projects and similar things are not unexpected, perhaps? And no other country accepts mutants like Japan, so black project speculation with human exploitation of powered people only makes sense in Japan? ... Although, yes, why wouldn't anyone else kidnap and drug a Gadgeteer / Devisor like how Hikaru and Morgana could have been, or the Artificers??

    ... What powers did the presumed Disappeared have???

    @Kattsun... Is that legal ?? ... I guess if you willingly declare that as volunteering for the company, etc... *sigh* Whatever, not dealing with this.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Malady.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #36 by Ametros
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  • Really cool seeing Eldritch and Okami interact, given they have some rather similar experiences. Not to mention it was great getting more of a look into how Hikaru ticks, and the relationship with Amaterasu.

    As for seeing Nikki around, everything said makes sense. She's lost her very personal tutor, so it's only natural to devote extra time studying, teaching and helping out. Keeping a close eye on her backyard bark baby certainly wouldn't hurt, as well as the aforementioned intake of Sidhe.

    Looking forward to seeing Hikaru (and especially Amaterasu) meet Nikki, and how that ends up playing out.

    As for the mysterious rescue at the end... Le Compte's wording insinuates that the young woman rescued is part of a number that disappeared - at the same time I'd think. Her treatment also implies that it was a kidnapping rather than anything else. So many questions are raised.

    Seriously, thank you for your time and effort. It is appreciated.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Ametros.
    7 years 10 months ago #37 by MageOhki
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  • Depends on the gadgetter, we all know about (or should) the 'overwork' syndrome, that's becoming openly talked about in Japan, mind you, but to be fair, Japanese gad/devs are treated as 'more equal', so in a lot of ways, most see it as being paid to play or build things. Which is exactly what the Corps want. It's kinda a "we're paying you to stay here and build things!" Now, again, to be fair, there's less freedom, per say on what they build, though most corps tend to take a more 'hands' off 'tude towards what their tinkerers do, simply because of the 'artist' mentality they approach the set with, but even then, a gag/dev who hasn't been doing things the corp can sell (even if it's to another corp), will get some pointed hints.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #38 by Katssun
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  • Malady wrote: @Kattsun... Is that legal ?? ... I guess if you willingly declare that as volunteering for the company, etc... *sigh* Whatever, not dealing with this.

    We're Salary Exempt ("exempt" from FLSA overtime rules). Technically, they don't have to pay us overtime at all, so of course we take the deal where they pay us.

    @MageOhki:
    Thanks for the insight. So it's a pretty grey area, and the companies go for licensing deal kind of stuff. Fits with the Japanese Consortium business culture? Like how Hitachi does everything from banking, making air conditioners, construction equipment, military vehicles, and of course their infamous magic wand.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Katssun.
    7 years 10 months ago #39 by MageOhki
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  • Pretty much, though it's what we'd call 'work for hire' more than 'licensing', generally in terms of IP rights, by and large. Now, to be fair, if a corp can't make easy use of the newest toy of one of their in house staff, they might 'sell' it off to a friendly 'rival', who can.
    7 years 10 months ago #40 by null0trooper
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  • Malady wrote: @Kattsun... Is that legal ?? ... I guess if you willingly declare that as volunteering for the company, etc... *sigh* Whatever, not dealing with this.


    It's ironic that the link goes back to Dept. of Labor, when Interior is pretty blatant in-house in its abuse of "exempt status" (my last office demanded that hours be tracked for exempt employees, as long as departure times were back-dated to keep the biweekly total at 80).

    In the end, it comes down to whether you want to keep your job, or not.

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #41 by null0trooper
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  • Ametros wrote: As for seeing Nikki around, everything said makes sense. She's lost her very personal tutor, so it's only natural to devote extra time studying, teaching and helping out. Keeping a close eye on her backyard bark baby certainly wouldn't hurt, as well as the aforementioned intake of Sidhe.


    Yes. There's been enough time for her to obtain a Bachelor's degree in something other than "unemployment". I'd figure her parents would insist on a pre-law or pre-med compatible degree (If she's as good at politicking as Caitlin says - a psych degree would make sense for the queen-to-come. She does have a vested interest in Hank's problems, her own, any emotional fallout from the next couple of years,) as something worthwhile that puts her back into interacting with as regular a set of humans as one finds at a good university.

    Spending a couple of years teaching at Whateley, learning more about magic and office politics, with a bit of modeling on the side would set her up for the costs of an MBA and law school. She doesn't have to be an expert at these things, but knowing what her employees and other underlings should be doing would serve her well. (My own OCs would likely be finishing their JROTC scholarship military service obligations by 2015. That's something Nikki wouldn't be doing.)

    Can you imagine Fey going through Quantico for a commission and getting practical leadership experience?
    :twisted:

    Now I'm left wondering how good is Misk U., and if it's close enough (without being a teleporter) for a person to work their way through college working part-time or summers at Whateley or ARC?

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #42 by Valentine
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  • It's entirely possible that Nikki got a BA in Magical Arts from Oxford. And then picked up a Teaching Certificate for New Hampshire.

    Don't Drick and Drive.
    7 years 10 months ago #43 by Iwasforger03
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  • wouldn't surprise me at all. Though I begin to see, slowly, why Carson apparently handpicked Le Compte as her emergency successor.

    I am a Sexy Shoeless God of War - So suck it CP!
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    7 years 10 months ago #44 by Bronzephoenix
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  • Well the other thing to take into consideration is that Liz was former hero having the next head be from evil side so to speak reminds people that whateley services both communities,
    7 years 10 months ago #45 by Kettlekorn
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  • Malady wrote:

    “Only real tradition regarding blades, is that you don’t unsheath them without them tasting blood before you put them back to rest.”


    DrawSwordDrawBlood is interesting... I guess that's a deliberate divergence from real life, for some reason? But, “Live steel is never drawn in a spar.” Training is all wood?

    Nah, they just have to remember to murder the steel before they draw it.

    Iwasforger03 wrote:

    null0trooper wrote:

    JG wrote: Better than S+M


    Such a thing exists?


    Good question. I do wonder what the...

    Sandra + Monica? Dude, please tell me that wasn't an incest joke...

    Pretty sure it was a BDSM joke, actually.

    I am the kernel that pops in the night. I am the pain that keeps your dentist employed.
    7 years 10 months ago #46 by Sir Lee
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  • Bronzephoenix wrote: Well the other thing to take into consideration is that Liz was former hero having the next head be from evil side so to speak reminds people that whateley services both communities,

    Well, during Liz' tenure, the "balance" was shown by having a Syndicate member in good... er, appropriate standing (Hartford) as Deputy Headmistress. In Gen2, they have a Headmaster with a Syndicate career and a Deputy Headmaster with a well-established career as an hero. Balance achieved.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 10 months ago #47 by JG
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  • Glad you guys liked it. This was my first-ever "deep collaboration" where myself and another author were exchanging roles and writing the tale line by line alternating the perspective to get a better feel for the characters.

    Mage and I wrote this on the fly as we would take turns adding lines and detail.

    I hope to do this again, because it was bloody fun to have two people in Gdocs shaping the tale into something neither of us really expected but seemed to turn out Ok.

    I wonder if I can con Morpheus or Elrod or EE or Bek or any of the others into doing similar things with me.
    7 years 10 months ago #48 by Katssun
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  • JG wrote: I wonder if I can con Morpheus or Elrod or EE or Bek or any of the others into doing similar things with me.

    Just a few suggestions:

    Nacht and Diamond on a magical adventure!

    Tether's first professional outing with somebody new.

    Date Night...chapter 2.

    Tansy and Murphy are ordered to work together to get Team Awesome under control.
    7 years 10 months ago #49 by JG
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  • Katssun wrote: Tansy and Murphy are ordered to work together to get Team Awesome under control.


    And here I thought me and Elrod were vying for the title of Heavyweight Literary Sadist...
    7 years 10 months ago #50 by Sir Lee
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  • Hmmm... instead of Date Night part 2, what about a follow-up on There's Something About Billie? Yeah, I know, no Starwolf available... but still, one wonders... maybe another date between one of the OC crowd and one of the characters of the other authors? Like, 'Shine asking Anomaly out?

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 10 months ago #51 by Iwasforger03
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  • JG wrote: Glad you guys liked it. This was my first-ever "deep collaboration" where myself and another author were exchanging roles and writing the tale line by line alternating the perspective to get a better feel for the characters.

    Mage and I wrote this on the fly as we would take turns adding lines and detail.

    I hope to do this again, because it was bloody fun to have two people in Gdocs shaping the tale into something neither of us really expected but seemed to turn out Ok.

    I wonder if I can con Morpheus or Elrod or EE or Bek or any of the others into doing similar things with me.


    I actually have some experience with this. My best friend and I run an rp solo campaign, as well as a side stories to a non-solo campaign, in joint sessions in Google Docs. It's incredible what you can come up with when you're bouncing off each other and surprising each other like that. Stories frequently go in directions nobody planned for, yet they feel very natural like that.

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    7 years 10 months ago #52 by elrodw
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  • Iwasforger03 wrote:

    JG wrote: Glad you guys liked it. This was my first-ever "deep collaboration" where myself and another author were exchanging roles and writing the tale line by line alternating the perspective to get a better feel for the characters.

    Mage and I wrote this on the fly as we would take turns adding lines and detail.

    I hope to do this again, because it was bloody fun to have two people in Gdocs shaping the tale into something neither of us really expected but seemed to turn out Ok.

    I wonder if I can con Morpheus or Elrod or EE or Bek or any of the others into doing similar things with me.


    I actually have some experience with this. My best friend and I run an rp solo campaign, as well as a side stories to a non-solo campaign, in joint sessions in Google Docs. It's incredible what you can come up with when you're bouncing off each other and surprising each other like that. Stories frequently go in directions nobody planned for, yet they feel very natural like that.


    It'll probably happen if he wants to co-write with me. I've done things like that with EE and it was an absolute blast - the amount of destructive creative energy coming together as our minds jointly twisted and plotted and schemed, while our poor characters suffered ...., BWAH HAH HAH HAH!!!

    I've already been quite liberal about asking others to contribute scenes - that's what Odds and Ends was all about, and with EE, and scenes from Bladedancer and Joe, and Gen 2 - yeah, it'll keep on happening. :evil:

    Never give up, Never surrender! Captain Peter Quincy Taggert
    7 years 10 months ago #53 by Cryptic
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  • Didn't Ito have a shrine already set up that could have been modified, or did it get removed when he retired?

    Ad I have read way to many Heralds of Valdemar books as I was thinking Cait was gonna set up a Hearthstone.

    I am a caffeine heathen; I prefer the waters of the mountain over the juice of the bean. Keep the Dews coming and no one will be hurt.
    7 years 10 months ago #54 by null0trooper
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  • Cryptic wrote: Didn't Ito have a shrine already set up that could have been modified, or did it get removed when he retired?

    Ad I have read way to many Heralds of Valdemar books as I was thinking Cait was gonna set up a Hearthstone.


    That may have been a butsudan instead of a kamidama , but I doubt either one would serve well as an essence battery, given Okami's power.

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #55 by JG
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  • Caitlin was cheating and taking shortcuts.

    Because you cannot have a shrine, temple or whatnot dedicated to a student or their spirit on campus.

    But a sundial has the celestial symbolism, and the person meditating is the one who casts the shadow to read the time.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #56 by Rose Bunny
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  • remember, Carson said there will be no (shrines for) worshiping your classmates.

    Peeper will have to take down the poster of Fey with the candle in front of it.

    High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan


    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Rose Bunny.
    7 years 10 months ago #57 by JG
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  • theres worship, and theres being creepy

    im pretty sure the differences are sharply defined.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #58 by Valentine
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  • Rose Bunny wrote: remember, Carson said there will be no (shrines for) worshiping your classmates.

    Peeper will have to take down the poster of Fey with the candle in front of it.


    Sara's Pack have to get rid of their beds.

    Don't Drick and Drive.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Valentine.
    7 years 10 months ago #59 by Sir Lee
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  • So being creepy is allowed? That's a relief for the members of the Church of Kellith and other GOO-worshipping groups... where creepiness is mandatory.

    Don't call me "Shirley." You will surely make me surly.
    7 years 10 months ago #60 by Arcanist Lupus
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  • If you don't mind me prying, which was written first - Mrs. Carson's outburst against shrines, or Hikaru's need for one?

    "Shared pain is lessened; shared joy, increased — thus do we refute entropy." - Spider Robinson
    7 years 10 months ago #61 by elrodw
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  • Arcanist Lupus wrote: If you don't mind me prying, which was written first - Mrs. Carson's outburst against shrines, or Hikaru's need for one?


    The ban was in September of 2007 in Gen 1. Hikaru's need for a shrine is Gen 2.

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    7 years 10 months ago #62 by Rose Bunny
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  • elrodw wrote:

    Arcanist Lupus wrote: If you don't mind me prying, which was written first - Mrs. Carson's outburst against shrines, or Hikaru's need for one?


    The ban was in September of 2007 in Gen 1. Hikaru's need for a shrine is Gen 2.


    I think Arcanist means "which of the stories was written first?"

    High-Priestess of the Order of Spirit-Chan


    7 years 10 months ago #63 by JG
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  • as far as literary timing?

    Elrod wrote carson's ban before me and mage decided to see how close we could skirt that line without going over it.
    7 years 10 months ago #64 by Ametros
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  • JG wrote: as far as literary timing?

    Elrod wrote carson's ban before me and mage decided to see how close we could skirt that line without going over it.


    I'm more thinking that you went over that line before dialing it back.

    :twisted:

    Seriously, thank you for your time and effort. It is appreciated.
    7 years 10 months ago #65 by MageOhki
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  • To be fair, Hikaru's not sure she needs one decidated to herself or Ammy. It does have to include a honden and a torii, meaning you really need a full up shrine complex. At least as far as Hikaru can figure out. She's not a miko in reality.
    7 years 10 months ago #66 by elrodw
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  • To be perfectly frank, the 'Shrines' scene started as a microscene that I had no intention of ever using in a canon story; it was just one of those amusing little thoughts that I scribbled down. Then as I thought about it, I decided I HAD to use that in a story. It was a matter of waiting for the right time and story to place it. It's been on the shelf for about 15 months. I have another couple of scenes which could have been microscenes which are still waiting their turn to play in prime-time.

    Never give up, Never surrender! Captain Peter Quincy Taggert
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #67 by Schol-R-LEA
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  • Your Muse works mainly in vignettes? I can sympathize. Mine doesn't really do anything else, for the most part. The few short story length fanfics I have actually finished (all for other series, sadly) have all been cases where something grabbed me and wouldn't let go until they got out; there have been a lot more where it just sort of collapsed partway through.

    Out, damnéd Spot! Bad Doggy!
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #68 by Malady
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  • @Schol-R-Lea - Are your fics mirrored anywhere? 'Cause some of the links on the page aren't working?

    Like HappyTyme™, Intent To Receive, and your homepage...
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Malady.
    7 years 10 months ago #69 by null0trooper
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  • elrodw wrote: To be perfectly frank, the 'Shrines' scene started as a microscene that I had no intention of ever using in a canon story; it was just one of those amusing little thoughts that I scribbled down. Then as I thought about it, I decided I HAD to use that in a story. It was a matter of waiting for the right time and story to place it. It's been on the shelf for about 15 months. I have another couple of scenes which could have been microscenes which are still waiting their turn to play in prime-time.


    Is that when the neopagan and other directly-affected students get told exactly which gods and kami are on the forbidden list?

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #70 by Anne
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  • I think the forbidden list is at least anyone whose spirit is presently attached to a student at Whately at least that would be my interpretation of the ban. Thus if someone like Jaz from my story were to make it there and be recognized then she couldn't have a shrine. However if there were a shrine that was erected previously I'm guessing it would stay. Part of the reason for Carson's edict is that we know that the Greek gods are on campus. But Sarah could have a shrine as well, and what about Pejuta? And Mieyt? Anyone else that you can think of? What if Belphagor isn't just an arrogant fat pig, what if he really is hosting a smidgen of that demon? Lots of questions. So Carson had to say no! Otherwise she couldn't maintain neutrality.
    7 years 10 months ago #71 by null0trooper
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  • So the answer is no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.

    Got it.

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #72 by Valentine
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  • null0trooper wrote: So the answer is no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.

    Got it.


    Students are not forbidden from worshipping any god, kami, other student, teacher, demon, or whatever. They are forbidden from building temples, shrines, churches, or other places of worship to the spirits, gods, demons or whatever that are or inhabit other students. You can worship Sara, but you can't make a shrine to her.

    It's a good thing Hello Kitty doesn't have a spirit inhabiting a student, Jade would be in trouble.

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    7 years 10 months ago #73 by null0trooper
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  • So the answer is still no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.

    Forum-posted ideas are freely adoptable.

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    7 years 10 months ago #74 by JG
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  • null0trooper wrote: So the answer is still no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.


    Get over this. Seriously. Students may not, at any point, act as religious figures on the campus. There is no Hello Kitty Messiah on campus, only Jade, the student.

    Nor may any student be made a point of worship on campus.

    Twist and turn it all you want. That's pretty much it. Not gonna change it, and the reason the rule came into effect was a student wanted to have a shrine/worship space because Kayda was on campus. They didn't want the space before Kayda came on campus. They wanted it because kayda was on campus.

    That was a big "HELL NO!"
    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #75 by MageOhki
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  • Ie, "No shrine/church/worship center of a student on campus while she's on campus/student of Whateley" is the rule, that's it.

    Hikaru has no disagreements.
    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by MageOhki.
    7 years 10 months ago #76 by Valentine
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  • JG wrote:

    null0trooper wrote: So the answer is still no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.


    Get over this. Seriously. Students may not, at any point, act as religious figures on the campus. There is no Hello Kitty Messiah on campus, only Jade, the student.

    Nor may any student be made a point of worship on campus.

    Twist and turn it all you want. That's pretty much it. Not gonna change it, and the reason the rule came into effect was a student wanted to have a shrine/worship space because Kayda was on campus. They didn't want the space before Kayda came on campus. They wanted it because kayda was on campus.

    That was a big "HELL NO!"


    And then Imperious heard about it and wanted a shrine to himself, along with Majestic and Counterpoint wanting their own shrines. Then 'Shine misheard and thought he was being kicked out. Kayda nearly died of embarrassment. Bast tried to get Miyet to build that Hello Kitty Shrine for Jade. Hippy wanted to build a shrine to Sara, but realized that her bed already was one.

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    7 years 10 months ago #77 by null0trooper
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  • MageOhki wrote: Ie, "No shrine/church/worship center of a student on campus while she's on campus/student of Whateley" is the rule, that's it.

    Hikaru has no[/] disagreements.


    Like the previous repetitions of the same theme, that isn't an answer to the question I've been asking, but let's use Hikaru as an example.

    How is a current or incoming student who is not Hikaru supposed to know that no shrine/church/worship space of Amaterasu is permitted after 2016?

    In this matter, Hikaru's agreement is irrelevant. If anything, she's the one person least likely to worship the entity and also the only student guaranteed to know. It is how the students who are not Hikaru are supposed to know that the student Hikaru is Amaterasu's daughter and therefore no worship spaces to either one are allowed.

    I'm not asking why no worship spaces to Amaterasu are allowed.

    I'm not asking whose worship is being curtailed among the student body by denying them worship space.

    I'm asking how or when the students who are not the representatives of the entities involved are expected to find out that their object of worship attends Whateley.

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    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #78 by Schol-R-LEA
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  • @null0trooper: My impression is this: the key factor here is regarding a shrine made specifically for veneration of the student, or a spirit known to be hosted by a student.

    I don't think they would object to a shrine to, say, Artemis, so long as it wasn't specifically focused on Feral. If it were more widely known that Feral is a New Olympian, it would complicate things, and yes, the rule is fraught with all sorts of issues about religious rights, but the main thing is that they don't want someone worshiping another student directly.

    So, if there had already been a Dianic temple on school grounds, and word then got around about who Erin is, I don't think they would force them to shut it down - but they would watch them like a hawk to make sure that things weren't tilting towards worshiping the personage of Erin herself. They also would not fault establishing such a shrine (that is, if her status as an Olympian were generally known), I think, so long as it was clear that Feral was not the specific object of veneration (though convincing the administration of this would be damn near impossible I expect).

    The same would apply to, say, a Hindu shrine or temple dedicated to (to use an example from some of my micros) Indra, were someone like my fan character Thunderbolt to show up.

    Malady wrote: @Schol-R-Lea - Are your fics mirrored anywhere? 'Cause some of the links on the page aren't working?

    Like HappyTyme™, Intent To Receive, and your homepage...


    I need to fix those, sorry. I don't know if I even have a copy of some of the stories anymore, and I haven't touched the home page in over ten years - it was one I threw together around 1997, originally, and never really redid because it just never seemed worth the effort. It is, not to put too fine a point on it, crap.

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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    7 years 10 months ago #79 by Valentine
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  • null0trooper wrote: Like the previous repetitions of the same theme, that isn't an answer to the question I've been asking, but let's use Hikaru as an example.

    How is a current or incoming student who is not Hikaru supposed to know that no shrine/church/worship space of Amaterasu is permitted after 2016?

    In this matter, Hikaru's agreement is irrelevant. If anything, she's the one person least likely to worship the entity and also the only student guaranteed to know. It is how the students who are not Hikaru are supposed to know that the student Hikaru is Amaterasu's daughter and therefore no worship spaces to either one are allowed.

    I'm not asking why no worship spaces to Amaterasu are allowed.

    I'm not asking whose worship is being curtailed among the student body by denying them worship space.

    I'm asking how or when the students who are not the representatives of the entities involved are expected to find out that their object of worship attends Whateley.


    Their worship is NOT being curtailed. They can continue to worship anyone they want.

    The most likely scenario is. Student goes to Admin to request building a shrine to Amaterasu. Request is denied as a student on campus has a direct link to her. Admin would not giver out information on the type of link, identity of the student, or anything like that.

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    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #80 by Kettlekorn
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  • null0trooper wrote: So the answer is still no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.

    So, everybody else seems to be missing your point here. It looks like you're specifically responding to this bit of Carson's rant:

    "Anyone who makes a request to erect such a worship space will be severely punished. Any avatar who requests or otherwise gives approval to devotees will be even more severely punished or expelled. DO I MAKE MYSELF CLEAR?"

    If taken literally, this does mean that you would have to do the research yourself ahead of time to find out which spirits are currently resident before making any request to build a shrine to them, or risk punishment. However, it's worth remembering that this is not an actual rule. It's just an angry Carson rant; it is likely a close approximation to the actual rule that is or will be implemented, but it skips all the details. If you were wanting to construct a shrine, you'd need to go look up what the actual rules are. Then, if the actual rules do include an automatic punishment for requesting a shrine to a resident spirit, you should try asking for a list of such spirits (the rules may even outline a process for doing this). It's also important to remember that admin are human and capable of leniency, so long as you don't make a nuisance of yourself. If you request a shrine to a spirit who you had no way of reasonably knowing was hanging out at Whateley, you would likely be simply informed of your error rather than punished.

    Of course, there is nothing stopping them from denying you a list of forbidden spirits and generally being petty, especially if you have historically tended to antagonize administration or otherwise caused problems. In that event, you should simply refrain from asking for permission to build any dedicated shrine to anybody at all. If your traditions demand otherwise, well, you frankly need better traditions. The overwhelming majority of Americans would not support the notion that your religious traditions entitle you to build structures on other people's property. Individual property rights trump religious obligations.

    That said, Carson's ruling is primarily about asking for permission to construct structures or claim public spaces. The first half of the rant (the part I omitted) can be interpreted to cover even a private little area set in your half of your dorm room, but it's unlikely anybody would actually care about that unless you made a big deal about it or were disruptive. And as I said earlier, it's a rant, not the actual rule. The actual rule is likely more clear about what is and is not covered.

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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Kettlekorn.
    7 years 10 months ago #81 by MageOhki
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  • Since this started thanks to Hikaru's offhand comment, I'll give you a boon.

    She's both right and wrong about the shrine. It wouldn't even have to have a enshrined kami to work as an energy store.
    Hell, the Temple itself isn't really needed for the storage parts.
    7 years 10 months ago #82 by elrodw
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  • I'm starting to wish I'd never written the damned piece.

    WOG here. Note, if you parse Carson's words, you will find the following two stipulations.

    Anyone who asks to erect a shrine to a current student will be punished.

    and the key one:

    Any avatar who asks to have a shrine or other worship space erected to worship that student's spirit will be severely punished and possibly expelled.

    Okay, so let's take cases. John Q. Lonewolf recognizes that Kayda has Ptesanwi's spirit. He wishes to worship Ptesanwi, so he asks administration (because he missed the briefing). Trouble. Punished. 2000 word essay, referenced and source? Hawthorne toilets? Groundskeeping picking up acorns? All viable. First time, probably light. Let's take the second case. Kayda asks John Q Lonewolf to build a shrine to her and Ptesanwi. Kayda has asked for something to worship her spirit. Severe punishment, including being expelled. Much more severe than John Q Lonewolf asking on his own.

    Do you see the difference here?

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    7 years 10 months ago - 7 years 10 months ago #83 by Schol-R-LEA
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  • @malady: I've fixed at least some of the links on my site, and added a few more stories and such. It's still The Vanity Page Time Forgot, but at least you can get to the fanfic that is on it now.

    @elrod: As I read what you said, the 'public space' part seems important here as well. A small shrine set up in someone's room, or in a private space such as a lab, would probably not be punished, so long as they didn't go inviting others to it. I imagine household-type shrines have been made inside dorm rooms before, even if we don't count things like Jadis' collection of White Witch related items.

    Mind you, if it was set up in a hidden room in the tunnel areas, and the administration found out, it probably would be punished, if only because it is using an area that is either unlisted (someone dug the room out without permission, even if it was long before the ones now using it came along), or intended for school use but currently unused (though there seem to be plenty of rooms which got built, but were never used, and then were surreptitiously removed from the plans and maps by any one of a number of parties).

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    Last Edit: 7 years 10 months ago by Schol-R-LEA.
    7 years 10 months ago #84 by elrodw
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  • elrodw wrote: Anyone who asks to erect a shrine to a current student will be punished.

    Okay, so let's take cases. John Q. Lonewolf recognizes that Kayda has Ptesanwi's spirit. He wishes to worship Ptesanwi, so he asks administration (because he missed the briefing). Trouble. Punished. 2000 word essay, referenced and source? Hawthorne toilets? Groundskeeping picking up acorns? All viable. First time, probably light.


    Just to clarify - suppose John Q Lonewolf makes a small shrine in his room, or worships without a shrine or sacred space, just does his homage/prayer/sacrifice (not goats!) to Ptesanwi. Free exercise of religion and would be permitted. As long as he doesn't ask to erect a dedicated public space to Ptesanwi, he's okay.

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    7 years 10 months ago #85 by null0trooper
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  • Kettlekorn wrote:

    null0trooper wrote: So the answer is still no, the students affected by the ban will never be told which gods and kami they are forbidden to worship according to their traditions, simply detained or expelled.

    So, everybody else seems to be missing your point here. It looks like you're specifically responding to this bit of Carson's rant:


    "Anyone who makes a request to erect such a worship space will be severely punished. Any avatar who requests or otherwise gives approval to devotees will be even more severely punished or expelled. DO I MAKE MYSELF CLEAR?"


    Exactly.


    Kettlekorn wrote: That said, Carson's ruling is primarily about asking for permission to construct structures or claim public spaces. The first half of the rant (the part I omitted) can be interpreted to cover even a private little area set in your half of your dorm room, but it's unlikely anybody would actually care about that unless you made a big deal about it or were disruptive.


    I do tend to interpret "any" as "any", yes.

    Likewise, I interpret "student's spirit" as pertaining to the spirit, not just the student holding it.

    As to the idea that nobody would actually care unless the student made a big deal about it or were disruptive? I'd be hard-pressed to agree with that.

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    7 years 10 months ago #86 by JG
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  • ok, thread derail over. back to Sunshine & Fury.

    no more avatargument.
    7 years 10 months ago #87 by DanZilla
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  • yep... we're not talking a personal space for devotion... it can be creepy and possibly illegal depending on what you're venerating/worshipping... but not forbidden as such.

    We're talking about construction of a public space for worship... it's not going to be allowed. And they won't look favorably toward unauthorized use of private spaces as well if someone were to keep it secret.

    This is specifically in conjunction with the worship of individuals present at the school. BUT, they are also not going to allow shrines/temples to be erected for other religions and beliefs unchecked as well. Just like anything else on campus... there ARE limits. The approximate space of the general campus is ONLY a half-mile and the school has to plan ANY external construction and keep track of what is where underground in order to keep things structurally sound.
    7 years 10 months ago #88 by Iwasforger03
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  • The girl they rescued isn't a mutant, she's just a victim of someone Whateley takes personally.

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    7 years 10 months ago #89 by Valentine
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  • elrodw wrote: I'm starting to wish I'd never written the damned piece.


    You just needed to tie in the popsicle-stick skyscraper. Or the giant magnifying glass. Or the exploding puddings. Or the escalator to nowhere.

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